Dies to Removal

lol Scumbag why did you claim Finn, that alone made Jones town in my eyes for most of the game...

Ok, he's lynched now. What's that theory Manders?

I got no PMs from mod.

No complaints here.

Okay then.

Unvote. Vote Ximbad.

This game has to end already, either way.

Sure, but in my case I have an additional variable, because I know that I'm town, and that ( G_R ) is town, but I'm ( G_R ), so I have a lot more possible combinations...

I don't know about lynching Ximbad yet. I just don't see a solid case for that. I don't like the whole I don't claim thing from Manders, because as much as she claims to be misleading Mafia, the town was also being misled. I just don't know how a vanilla gets info about being targeted, specially in a basic, but you guys have more experience than me. In other words, I don't fully trust Manders and would support that lynch. Now that DSM is providing some more content, I can at least put something else on my spreadsheet other than "counterclaimed ( N_S )".

Let's hear from teefo, then.

I didn't want to post, because that meant more posts for you to read.

So, we are lynching Ximbad by elimination?

I'm all for it, but he needs his PM and that in order to start participating... and that's what we need, his participation.

He confirmed in yet?

I'd like to hear from Jones.

@G_R

Do you mind showing me what you are talking about? If you don't mind waiting, I can do it tomorrow, but it would be helpful. I am assuming you are looking at one specific interaction?

Here you go:
http://community.ist.utl.pt/search.php? ... hor=Yannus

And yes, GR. I wouldn't put it past Yanni to bus early on.

Funny. Now that I reread the above link, he was also emphasizing you as a good lynch. The way he handled himself on the day he got lynched, I can easily see him busing both scum buddies in order to
distance himself, which would end up being too obvious if either of you flip scum.

FTR: I'm leaning towards a Manders lynch, but I'd like to have more input from Jones first.

@The Guardian:

Do you think Yanni was busing Ximbad early game? I read those interactions and that pretty much has Ximbad labeled as town on my spreadsheet...

So, you want to lynch an un-CC'd PR?

#tellmemore

I did not say that. I answered your question.

I do want to hear from everybody. I'm still waiting for those claims...

Because you're the ones who have already voted today.

Shouldn't you vote for Jones? I remember the last time someone voted for an "alias" and not the user name, the vote didn't get counted.

So, we're looking at two scum left, unless anyone expects a different number. @Manders & PhantomS, who would be your second suspects?

http://adventuretime.wikia.com/wiki/Doctor_Princess

About my claim, IDK if we have other power roles left, but I figure withholding what my role is is pretty much useless now, since we're all supposed to be claiming today and I don't think my ability will be much use if we don't lynch scum today.

I'm not really a princess, but my name is Doctor Princess. I think you can guess what my role is just out of flavor.

I need to re-read from the beginning. I don't get where this Yanni wagon came from. His defensiveness does raise an eyebrow, but I tend to agree with Col. Khaddafi. In my short experience with the game, people behaving like that have been usually townies playing poorly, and giving away an easy mislynch. Not that his posting after being confronted by PhantomS doesn't look scummy, but I keep that possibility open, for now.

Hesitance to join the Yanni wagon noted.

I was not convinced yet.

I don't think that being aggressive is scummy, especially on day 1. On the contrary, I assume mafia will try to start the game with a low profile. Sure, experienced players may tap on that, but in that case I will say it's a null tell.

On the other hand, that "tag-team" accusation, to call it that, is making my "spider-sense" tingle.

Vote: imopen2

Attempting to detract from the Yanni wagon? Maaaaaaaaaaaybe.

Uh... no?

yeah but the quote you quoted saying "lol imopen2's vote was a quote fail" but you linked to Khaddaffi fosing Ximbad so I haven't seen this alleged voting quote fail

It's like you're not even trying Yanni. But it strikes me as if you're "not trying" on purpose.

Unvote Ximbad, vote Yanni

That said, I'm going out of the country tomorrow, for the rest of the week, and will be preparing for the trip today, so V/LA.

Finally gets on the Yanni wagon.[/quote:
4nkgvh1m]
Also, for someone who's "careful with votes" it's pretty dangerous to vote someone so close to lynch when you're going to be gone for the rest of the week.

How can you justify this?

I took my time with that vote. I was pretty sure the lynch was happening and even when I issued a V/LA I knew I still would have access to read the thread and quickly unvote if necessary. The V/LA was more so people wouldn't expect me to post or answer questions during my trip.

[quote="Captain Murphy » Fri Jan 04, 2013 7:57 pm":
4nkgvh1m]

Fair enough. I failed to factor in that this is your first mafia game.

Unvote

So?

I just tend to be careful when voting.

How do you explain that the two votes you made previous to this were not careful at all, but you voting as soon as you saw something worth voting?

Being careful doesn't mean that I won't vote, or that I will always be right when voting. In imopen2's case I unvoted because of that. I used a vote on you to try to get you to claim. Perhaps careful is not a precise word, but I like to have some reasoning behind my votes, and if I'm not sure of something, I will try to factor as many things as I can before issuing a vote.

I'll answer your questions and claim as soon as I'm not on a phone. Question: is it normal to be notified of visits like this as town vanilla?

Two ways:

1). The tone

The way you about asking: "What can we do" makes it sound like you are trying to appeal to her, rather than explaining why she should be.

2). The lack of attention to detail

Her being mislynched doesn't put the town in a bad position. What happens is that we outright lose...

6 alive with 2 mafia. Simple math is your friend here.

That's why I dislike your post, and even your last one tries to justify your post by comparing it to mine. I feel pretty confidant in my scum read on you now, unless Manders has something to share.

1. I didn't say "what can we do?". I asked "what needs to happen?". Like, her stubbornness to not claim if she is
town can cost us the game. Unless she is NOT town, which is what I'm trying to establish.
2. So? I miscounted. I see our posts:

Manders, what needs to happen for you to claim?

Manders,

What in any of your gaming experience at salvation makes you think this cryptic claiming in mis-lynch or lose is a good idea?

Do you agree that if you are in fact town and get mislynched because of this, it would put us in a difficult position?

We are one simple misstep away from losing.

A question and a warning. They look pretty similar to me. I didn't even think my post needed defending in the first place.

How is my post any different from yours?

Manders, what needs to happen for you to claim? Do you agree that if you are in fact town and get mislynched because of this, it would put us in a difficult position?

Yikes, deadline.

I'm quite busy at work. Probably won't be able to post again for a day or two, so for now I will share my thoughts about the alive players:

• imopen2: If he's scum, he is playing the noob card quite well, I will say. I can't really tell right now.
• Mogadishu Jones: The only case against him is "he's such a good player, he was busing Yanni since the begining". I can see that as possible, but not conclusive at all and certainly not something to be used for a lynch on this day.
• PhantomS: I have no reason to suspect him. Cannot confirm him as town yet, even after his shot claim, but I'm pretty sure he is.
• The Guardian: I have him as Khaddafi's hammer, and I was following the latest wagon
  on him to see how he reacted. I must say that after the latest posts I get a strong town vibe from him.
• Ximbad: He has posted very little but Yanni was pushing really hard on a Ximbad wagon and given Yanni's play in this game, I highly doubt that it was a busing strategy, which makes me put Ximbad under the townie column.
• Manders: I'm not sure how I feel about her reluctance to claim, after hinting at having some ability that lets her know whether she has been targeted. That little "claim" stroke me as an attempt to get a PR to out themselves. Also, hinting at being a PR could be used to mislead a protective role, if we have one left, into targetting her. I do want to hear that claim, so vote Manders

GR, I believe for my comment on him being super passive. I actually just caught a scum in a recent game for doing exactly that. It's a common technique for mafia to use, especially newer ones.

I'm sorry, is this phrased awkwardly, or is it a language barrier thing? What I understand is that you're saying that I'm being super passive as a scum technique? I'll just say that some people play aggressively and that I play passively. I like to be careful (most of the time) and I mostly ask questions. People have called me scum in the past because of this style of play, so it's not really something I'm gonna be too concerned about.

That said, I believe that all the points that you have raised about M.Jones could be very valid,
except for the fact that it's mostly speculation on your part. It may be like you said, if you flip town your logic will make sense. But right now I'm not convinced anymore that lynching you is the best course of action either.

That leaves us with Manders, who never answered my question about her ability and now that PhantomS has asked for a claim, I'd like to hear that as well.

We need to hit scum today, now that we lost a PR and PhantomS' shot has been used, a mislynch would give them a huge advantage.

I read your post as "either Jones or Manders, but mostly Jones". Your theory that "bad NKs" come from "poor/new players" contrasts with the fact that you have one of the most experienced players as your main suspect. Like you said, they might be role-hunting, but also seemingly random night kills could nullify our protective role, if we have one, and that seems like a smart strategy too.

If there's a chance that they have a role-cop, I don't discard the possibility that PhantomS is on their team and that either him or the other had the vig ability and used it when they found the cop. This is pure speculation, I know, and I'm just keeping this option open, but I still have PhantomS in my townie column for the time being.

@The Guardian: So you're basically saying that everyone who is not you or PhantomS and is alive now could be scum?

I'm OK with lynching The Guardian. Let's hear that claim.

Then there's Manders. There are some things in The Guardian's posts when talking to/about her that seem suspicious to me. Specifically the part where they talk about Yanni's attempt at getting off the hook when he was caught lying.

The only thing strange about the vig would be if someone else would counter-claim. Why would a scum vig say "I vigged him, sorry, my bad". He went with a gut feeling and hit a PR, I don't blame him.

@imopen2 can't you just count yourself? It's only been a page and a half at most since last night...

So, anyone want to admit to targeting me last night? Because I was definitely targeted.

How do you know?

Do you think it could have been Murphy checking on you?

You are making no sense. I think that you are lying.

Vote Yanni

because I think she is scum, and if she isn't she's a good player and likely to be targetted for a nightkill.

Do you know the purpose of a watcher?

Why did you choose her?

the fact that I didn't post about is obvious that I was implying I didn't find anything, otherwise I would have.

Who was your target?