LEGO Movie Mafia - Game Over - Town Win

[Azrael]

He uses more emojis when hes scum too.

Parenthetically, not even close to true. (See World Dom 2, for instance).

[Dechs Kaison]

@Mod - If we have submitted our three ideas already, is there any way to scrap the plans and ask for something else?

I've already submitted my three ideas. I won't be able to participate in any kind of Master Plan, but there is something I could contribute.

One of my plans (the Vig shot) was specifically to get a an idea from the Mod and find out where powers fell on the time scale.

[Azrael]

I use extra emoticons when I'm excited / poking people / trolling for reactions, ordinarily.

[hamfactorial]

It doesn't "equate" a vig claim, hes trying to make it seem like thats what he "meant all along" post facto.

Not buying.

His other posts towards me have the ex post facto thing going on, too. Have you played with him before? Does he do this by habit? Do you think it's a cover for scummy play?

Yes, he's played with me probably a dozen times. Yes, people need my play explained to
them all the time. Obviously, he does.

The pertinent question is whether you believe it's more or less likely for a townie or a scum to misunderstand what Dechs was trying to say. It's apparent from the public record that I understood Dechs to be claiming a special vigilante power that was exclusive to Kpaca's claimed role - I wrote posts in line with that multiple times. Also, not only the vanilla PM but Kpaca's own role-claim was on record at this point, so unless you think I had a complete brain hemorrhage and/or the entire mafia team doesn't have any builders on it, I'm finding it kind of hard to envision the scenario where I'm supposed to be a scum who's not aware that people in this game can build different stuff.

Maybe Kpaca would care to explain what he thinks was going on in my head, there, as mafia. Like, what do you think I was *actually* thinking, if this is supposed to be my retcon scenario? That this was some kind of conventional mafia setup with one vig, one doc, and that I
can't read? Right.

Misunderstanding what another player is saying is not a legitimate scum tell here, and if you lynch over it, you're just tilting over how eager you are to catch a scum Azrael that doesn't even exist this game, Kpaca. You've got a bad gut read, and an ax to grind, not a legit concern.

Your scum theory requires me to not understand that people build things in this game. Seriously?

Homie I don't know what powers the mafia have or don't have. Why don't you tell me more about the mafia? Do you know a lot about them?

I'll put in my Wraith223 hat and point out that the Lego movie villain wanted suppress creativity and building. Maybe you're scum without a builder ability and maybe you just didn't read the sample role PM. Occam's Razor suggests that you being dumb is a very simple explanation for all of this.

[Dechs Kaison]

I've already submitted my three ideas. I won't be able to participate in any kind of Master Plan, but there is something I could contribute.

Clarifying this: I mean that I can't build a piece of a larger invention to confirm my townyness, but one of my invention ideas can allow me to interact with other builders and what they are building.

[Azrael]

@Mod - If we have submitted our three ideas already, is there any way to scrap the plans and ask for something else?

I've already submitted my three ideas. I won't be able to participate in any kind of Master Plan, but there is something I could contribute.

One of my plans (the Vig shot) was specifically to get a an idea from the Mod and find out where powers fell on the time scale.

A comprehensive Master Plan probably won't work out intelligently, especially since I'd expect the mafia to be able to counter things that we discuss in public unusually easily, but punitive plans for scum suspects, and maybe a few other workarounds....Hmm. Maybe even some of those won't work if they're discussed.

I suppose
there's a limit to how many things the mafia can build that counter what we discuss, though, so maybe that's the correct way to approach things. Overload them with multiple counter-measures and plans to assure that some of them get through intact.

[Azrael]

Homie I don't know what powers the mafia have or don't have.[/quote]

Yeah, precisely. I'm saying your theory only works if the mafia DON'T have building powers, and aren't aware of them. I wouldn't care to presume that that's the case in order to justify killing someone off, but if you're SO EXCITE that you want to just ignore that problem, I mean, feel free.

[quote="hamfactorial']
Why don't you tell me more about the mafia? Do you know a lot about them? [/quote]

I'm not telling you a damn thing about the mafia, because i can't. What I'm telling you is what your own case requires you to assume about the mafia in order for it
to have a hope of making any kind of sense, as opposed to the simple and uncomplicated explanation of what was going through my head.

[quote="hamfactorial']Occam's Razor suggests that you being dumb is a very simple explanation for all of this.[/quote]

Occam's razor prefers the most simplistic solution. Your scenario requires me to:

1. Be scum on a team without builders.
2. Think that all the townies received conventional roles.
3. Miss reading the vanilla PM
4. Miss reading Kpaca talk about building things

"Being dumb", isn't a simple solution to explain it, it's a complicated clusterfuck requires four separate conditions to all be true. It's also completely out of character for me, as even Kpaca's admitted.

That's opposed to the simple explanation of a townie who mistook the guy who tried to counter-claim Kpaca as someone who *could* actually (and was trying to) counter-claim Kpaca, by claiming to have a special affinity for vigging people.

[Dechs Kaison]

Unvote Azrael

[Azrael]

Splicing quotes on this software is mildly awful. Supposed to say:

Homie I don't know what powers the mafia have or don't have.

Yeah, precisely. I'm saying your theory only works if the mafia DON'T have building powers, and aren't aware of them. I wouldn't care to presume that that's the case in order to justify killing someone off, but if you're SO EXCITE that you want to just ignore that problem, I mean, feel free.

Why don't you tell me more about the mafia? Do you know a lot about them?

I'm not telling you a damn thing about the mafia, because I can't. What I'm telling you is what your own case requires you to assume about the mafia in order for it to have a hope of making any kind of
sense.

Occam's Razor suggests that you being dumb is a very simple explanation for all of this.

Occam's razor prefers the most simplistic solution. Your scenario requires me to:

1. Be scum on a team without builders.
2. Think that all the townies received conventional roles.
3. Miss reading the vanilla PM
4. Miss reading Kpaca talk about building things

"Being dumb", isn't a simple solution to explain it, it's a complicated clusterfuck requires four separate conditions to all be true. It's also completely out of character for me, as even Kpaca's admitted.

That's opposed to the simple explanation of a townie who mistook the guy who tried to counter-claim Kpaca as someone who *could* actually (and was trying to) counter-claim Kpaca, by claiming to have a special affinity for vigging people.

[Azrael]

*watches Ham browse then leave thread without replying to above*

[hamfactorial]

@Az - I'm not so excite, certainly not trying to justify lynching you. I'm not even voting for you!

MoJo states that he's going to build a shotgun and use it on you, so that's great. It will help figure out his alignment and give me better reads when you flip.

asking questions of you and talking about what I see is useful in the meantime, so I'll continue to interact.

Additionally, thank you for fixing those quotes. They got really screwed up last time I split one of your posts up for inline replies.

[hamfactorial]

[Dechs Kaison]

Hey guys, I wanted to isolate Captain Murphy's and Imopen's posts so far. I just quoted everything they typed up, so this could be long.

Vote GR for not posting in Spanish

Vote: Az

You're not the sheriff around here.

I am also curious as to why you would assume 3 scum. I've never played with you, but from what I understand you are a veteran of mafia, and therefore it is hard to believe this was a slip, nevertheless it's definitely worth noting.

Huh. That was quick.

[Azrael]

@Az - I'm not so excite, certainly not trying to justify lynching you.

o rly

O rly x 1000

I'm not even voting for you!

So we should just ignore the parts where you try to support the idea that I'm dumb scum who didn't read the thread at all, and not acknowledge that that could be either a prelude to a vote, or encouraging other players to get on board with the crappy wagon?

MoJo states that he's going to build a shotgun and use it on you, so that's great. It will help figure out his alignment and give me better reads
when you flip.

Wanting people to die so that you can get better reads is one of the classic throwaway scum reasons for not caring if someone dies. I think in this case, it seems atleast feasible you might actually buy that, though.

asking questions of you and talking about what I see is useful in the meantime, so I'll continue to interact.

Additionally, thank you for fixing those quotes. They got really screwed up last time I split one of your posts up for inline replies.

You're very welcome.

I'll have to remember not to rely on the browser-detector in the future. *wipes egg off face*

[Stardust]

@Mod - If we have submitted our three ideas already, is there any way to scrap the plans and ask for something else?

You're asking for details about player-specific roles (which I wouldn't normally answer), but since this was given in the sample town PM... No, there's no way to do so. The reason I limited it to three requests is so that a Master Builder can't just ask me for 100 different time requirements. It's for my own sanity since I do need to carefully decide exactly how powerful the requested ability really is, so it takes some time. Even one Master Builder would be too much work for me, let alone [censored]!


Votecount!

hamfactorial (2): RedNihilist, Azrael
Dechs Kaison (2): hamfactorial,
( G_R )
Azrael (2): imopen2, Mogadishu Jones
( G_R ) (1): Captain Murphy

Not voting: Lord_Mcdonalds, Dechs Kaison

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.

[Mogadishu Jones]

unvote: vote dechs

And ftr i was mistaken, i didnt submit a lego shotgun, but a lego catapault. Is really irrelevant tho.

[hamfactorial]

@Az - I'm not so excite, certainly not trying to justify lynching you.

o rly

O rly x 1000

I'm not even voting for you!

So we should just ignore the parts where you try to support the idea that I'm dumb scum who didn't read the thread at all, and not acknowledge that that could be either a prelude to a vote, or encouraging other players to get on board with the crappy wagon?

[quote="hamfactorial":
zvc5dg64]
MoJo states that he's going to build a shotgun and use it on you, so that's great. It will help figure out his alignment and give me better reads when you flip.

Wanting people to die so that you can get better reads is one of the classic throwaway scum reasons for not caring if someone dies. I think in this case, it seems atleast feasible you might actually buy that, though.

asking questions of you and talking about what I see is useful in the meantime, so I'll continue to interact.

Additionally, thank you for fixing those quotes. They got really screwed up last time I split one of your posts up for inline replies.

You're very welcome.

I'll have to remember not to rely on the browser-detector in the future. *wipes egg off face*[/quote]
@Az I'm not interested in watching people die in a
general sense, I'm only interested in you because if someone must die I'd prefer it to be someone who annoyed me. If MoJo stays on your ass and follows through on his vig, it will be your own doing.

It's D1 where information is at its very worst, so I don't really care who dies. You're all black boxes of uncertain motivation. I don't trust anyone, and certainly not the guy trying to lynch me for RVS banter.

But hey, playful smilies so it's ok.

[Captain Murphy]

Wow a lot of shit has happened, I'll make a catch up post today.

[Mogadishu Jones]

Ok

[imopen2]

so i just read the most of page 2, and then skimmed page 3 after seeing AZ'S HUGE FUCKING SLIP WTF WHY IS HE NOT DEAD??

[imopen2]

like...did i miss something during my skim? do i have to actually read something more than that az has no idea how our town roles work?

[imopen2]

Hey guys, I wanted to isolate Captain Murphy's and Imopen's posts so far. I just quoted everything they typed up, so this could be long.

Vote GR for not posting in Spanish

Vote: Az

You're not the sheriff around here.

I am also curious as to why you would assume 3 scum. I've never played with you, but from what I understand you are a veteran of mafia, and
therefore it is hard to believe this was a slip, nevertheless it's definitely worth noting.

Huh. That was quick.

i'm busy. i got this fucking wagon going. lego

[imopen2]

i think G_R is scum too, but i'd have to skim again

[imopen2]

glad to be on kpaca's team

[RedNihilist]

About the RedN vote, the fact that your rather fishy claim that he's town can't really be analyzed (WIFOM) I wanted a reaction from him, but he seems to either be MIA or just lurking like hell.

About the RedN vote, the fact that your rather fishy claim that he's town can't really be analyzed (WIFOM) I wanted a reaction from him, but he seems to either be MIA or just lurking like hell.

Red lives in a
different time zone (Italy, IIRC). It's going to be hard to get real time conversation with him going.

Thanks. Good to know. My vote for him was yesterday IIRC, so I believe he's had time to check the thread since.

I'm sorry, the timezone / mother language issue is still there, I'm trying to keep up with the posts reading but I'm still all WIFOMy in forming anopinion.

[( G_R )]

i think G_R is scum too, but i'd have to skim again

Ah there it is. I cannot have a D1 without someone saying those three words.

Are you saying that I'm scum for not going after Az? What's your opinion on DK?

[( G_R )]

About the RedN vote, the fact that your rather fishy claim that he's town can't really be analyzed (WIFOM) I wanted a reaction from him, but he seems to either be MIA or just lurking like hell.

About the RedN vote, the fact that your rather fishy claim that he's town
can't really be analyzed (WIFOM) I wanted a reaction from him, but he seems to either be MIA or just lurking like hell.

Red lives in a different time zone (Italy, IIRC). It's going to be hard to get real time conversation with him going.

Thanks. Good to know. My vote for him was yesterday IIRC, so I believe he's had time to check the thread since.

I'm sorry, the timezone / mother language issue is still there, I'm trying to keep up with the posts reading but I'm still all WIFOMy in forming anopinion.

Nessun problema.

[Dechs Kaison]

Nessun problema.

Be honest. You learned that from Assassin's Creed games.

[Azrael]

like...did i miss something during my skim? do i have to actually read something more than that az has no idea how our town roles work?

Yeah, you missed the part where people take deep breaths and use logic to analyze things.

Occam's razor prefers the most simplistic solution. Your scenario requires me to:

1. Be scum on a team without builders.
2. Think that all the townies received conventional roles.
3. Miss reading the vanilla PM
4. Miss reading Kpaca talk about building things

"Being dumb", isn't a simple solution to explain it, it's a complicated clusterfuck requires four separate conditions to all be true. It's also completely out of character for me, as even Kpaca's admitted.

nThat's opposed to the simple explanation of a townie who mistook the guy who tried to counter-claim Kpaca as someone who *could* actually (and was trying to) counter-claim Kpaca, by claiming to have a special affinity for vigging people.

[Azrael]

Town-
Azrael
Hamfactorial - Animus seems to be motivated by natural town dislike for being attacked, confidence appears to be genuine
Dechs - Some logic tells, but natural lines of play and earnestness
Mogadishu Jones - The D1 claim is usually a town tell. Don't like how inflexible he's being in his chosen line of play, but on balance, more likely to be town than not pending further behavioral tells.

Null-
Imopen2 - Lots of hyperbole and negativity/emotion in his attack style. Still trying to place the cause for that prior to placing him as either town or scum. I'm thinking either scum or he really dislikes my posting style and thinks that's a good reason to kill people plus bad case logic, but keeping an open mind pending further observation.
Lord_Mcdonalds - Post more
Red Nihilist - Post More
Captain Murphy - Post more

Scum-
( G_R ) - The vote on Dechs while ignoring commenting on me was bad. His focus of
topics has continued to be scum-styled, he posts when involved by others, doesn't offer opinions unsolicited. Still hasn't taken a position on my wagon, IIRC.

[Azrael]

Vote Gaea's Regent

[RedNihilist]

That's not happening.
I want to see that Lego Catapult at work.

[Dechs Kaison]

That's not happening.
I want to see that Lego Catapult at work.

GR isn't the one with the catapult.

[Dechs Kaison]

I agree with the sentiment, of course. We can't lynch Jones because he's made such a strong/verifiable claim. He's either town or hanged scum tomorrow.

Not sold on GR being scum yet.

Concerned mostly with the lurkers, CM, LMD, and Red in that order.

[RedNihilist]

Ooooh I'm stupid -_-

[Azrael]

I agree with the sentiment, of course. We can't lynch Jones because he's made such a strong/verifiable claim. He's either town or hanged scum tomorrow.

Not sold on GR being scum yet.

Concerned mostly with the lurkers, CM, LMD, and Red in that order.

Even if I flip town, that doesn't necessarily mean Kpaca's an auto-lynch. Being wrong doesn't mean he's scum, unless that's the reason why he's wrong.

[Dechs Kaison]

I agree with the sentiment, of course. We can't lynch Jones because he's made such a strong/verifiable claim. He's either town or hanged scum tomorrow.

Not sold on GR being scum yet.

Concerned mostly with the lurkers, CM, LMD, and Red in that order.

Even if I flip town, that doesn't necessarily mean Kpaca's an auto-lynch. Being wrong doesn't mean he's scum, unless that's the reason why he's wrong.

I meant that if he can't shoot you tomorrow, that should be auto-lynch.

[RedNihilist]

That's not 100% accurate either (roleblocking is still a thing, ain't it?), but at this point I'd avoid wasting a lynch on him when he can actually prove his statementif the shot goes through unanswered.

[Dechs Kaison]

Yeah, but a dayroleblock? Is that an actual thing? Doesn't matter, we can burn that bridge while we cross it.

The point is, he made a probably verifiable claim. No hanging Jones today.

[hamfactorial]

Wow a lot of shit has happened, I'll make a catch up post today.

Lies.

Unvote
Vote CM