Dies to Removal

I posted this in the Mono Red Scrumper thread, but in order to avoid clogging up that thread with splash discussion I made a new thread for it.

So basically Mono Red with a light white splash, please rip it apart:

[deck]Lands (22)
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Temple of Triumph
14 Mountain

Creatures (23)
4 Monastery Swiftspear
3 Foundry Street Denizen
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Borderland Marauder
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
1 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Iroas, God of Victory

Spells (15)
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Lightning Strike
3 Chained to the Rocks
3 Hordeling Outburst
1 Hall of Triumph

Sideboard
1 Hall of Triumph *
2 Harness by Force *
1 Chained to the Rocks
2 Banishing Light
1 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Iroas, God of Victory
1 Mountain
1 Ashcloud Phoenix
3 Arc Lightning *
2 Magma Spray *
[/deck]

- White splash for CttR and Iroas. BL in sideboard, maybe Ride Down
- Temples instead of Mana Confluence for budget scrump reasons, but scry helps because no Magma Jet.
- Sideboard is a pile, but * marked ones I really want there.

Chains is most useful turns 3-5 here and 8 sources are not likely to be reliable. 10-12 white sources was used last season and it wasn't necessarily trying to cast Charm or Helix turn 3-5, it was for the Chains; that was with Magma Jet.

The mana base is indeed my biggest concern. I'd be more comfortable with this:

4x Battlefield Forge
4x Mana Confluence
2x Temple of Triumph
12x Mountain

Or even 4x Temples and 2x MCs. But I'm stubborn and won't get the MCs. Wind-Scarred Crags aren't so interesting either, because playing more taplands in an aggro deck isn't a great idea.

Hi Platypus! I like that deck, BUT the 4 temples. Since I'm not testing it, I have to ask... Are you losing tempo in critical turns?
I would be TERRORized to open an hand with only temples in an aggro deck.

That's inconvenient, since I'm stubborn too (and refuse to get the MCs.)

What does Iroas do? A 4cmc cant-block spell?

That "prevent all damage" clause seems worth the splash...

[deck]
4 monastery swiftspear
4 firedrinker satyr
4 seeker of the way
4 borderland marauder
4 goblin rabblemaster

4 chained to the rocks
4 magma jet
4 lightning strike
3 searing blood
4 stoke the flames

4 temple of triumph
4 battlefield forge
1 wind-scarred crag
2 plains
10 mountain

2 erase
2 ride down
1 searing blood
4 satyr firedancer
4 arc lightning
2 harness by force
[/deck]

This is where I would start.

Or swap the Marauders for a Mountain, two Chandra, and the fourth Searing Blood.

Had a dream that I was playing R/W. List was something like this:

[deck]
Creatures 16
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster

Spells 22
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
4 Searing Blood
4 Stoke the Flames
3 Deflecting Palm
3 Chained to the Rocks

Lands 22
11 Mountain
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Battlefield Forge
1 Wind-Scarred Crag
2 Plains

Sideboard 13
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
3 Wind-Scarred Crag
3 Banishing Light
2 Circle of Flame
1 Chained to the Rocks
[/deck]

2 slots in the sideboard, with likely nods to Arc Lightning, more Circle of Flame, Anger of the Gods, and Chandra, Pyromaster. Reprisal, Erase, Suspension Field. Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker

The plan seems to be:

Game 1, The Embodiment of the Beatdown.

Game 2, if prudent, Suprise! I'm Now Playing R/W Control.

The maindeck seems good enough to work on it's own, so someone could probably make an actual sideboard for it and have some success.

[deck]
4 monastery swiftspear
4 firedrinker satyr
4 seeker of the way
4 borderland marauder
4 goblin rabblemaster

4 chained to the rocks
4 magma jet
4 lightning strike
3 searing blood
4 stoke the flames

4 temple of triumph
4 battlefield forge
1 wind-scarred crag
2 plains
10 mountain

2 erase
2 ride down
1 searing blood
4 satyr firedancer
4 arc lightning
2 harness by force
[/deck]

This is where I would start.

I like this better than my attempt. I think my biggest problem was trying to force Foundry Street Denizen into the deck in addition to the other one-drops. This skews the manabase into too much red and too few white sources. I forgot about Seeker of the Way.

That "prevent all damage" clause seems worth the splash...

Yes, this + the Goblin War Drums effect is what makes Iroas somewhat interesting. In INN/RTR season our red decks had to fight through midrange Jund (with Thragtusk), or Restoration Angels. We did this partly with Pyreheart Wolf on the third turn, with an alpha strike on turn four (although BTEs on turn 2 and Hellrider on turn 4 helped a lot as well). Pyreheart Wolf was always that groan inducing pick up and read card.

Now we have to fight through a similar midrange standard, and we can play either Goblin Rabblemaster (preferably) or Hordeling Outburst on turn three, with Iroas on turn 4. Or build a horde on turn 1-4, and then alpha strike with Iroas in turn 5. Iroas is under the radar, he hasn't been played anywhere and I'm sure lots of players don't take him into account.

I tested 3 Chained in R/w Aggro with 4 MC, 4 Forge, 2 Temple, 10 Mountain and it always seemed like I was either getting the mana I needed and no Chained or getting Chained with either no white mana or no Mountains... The stars only aligned so that I could actually cast Chained in 1 out of about 20 games I tested, so I ended up just dropping it. You might have more luck with this build with a bit more mana which is meant to play a longer game, though.

I think Ride Down is a fine substitute if 10 Mountains won't get you there as often as you want.

Had a dream that I was playing R/W. List was something like this:

[deck]
Creatures 16
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Eidolon of the Great Revel
4 Seeker of the Way
4 Goblin Rabblemaster

Spells 22
4 Magma Jet
4 Lightning Strike
4 Searing Blood
4 Stoke the Flames
3 Deflecting Palm
3 Chained to the Rocks

Lands 22
11 Mountain
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Battlefield Forge
1 Wind-Scarred Crag
2 Plains

Sideboard 13
2 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
3 Wind-Scarred Crag
3 Banishing Light
2 Circle of Flame
1 Chained to the Rocks
[/deck]

2 slots in the sideboard, with likely nods to Arc Lightning, more Circle of Flame, Anger of the Gods, and Chandra, Pyromaster. Reprisal, Erase, Suspension Field. Sarkhan, the Dragonspeaker

The plan seems to be:

Game 1, The Embodiment of the Beatdown.

Game 2, if prudent, Suprise! I'm Now Playing R/W Control.

The maindeck seems good enough to work on it's own, so someone could probably make an actual sideboard for it and have some success.

Been testing mainboard games against Kevin Jones Jeskai burn list, which I expect to be very popular this weekend.

The R/W list seems to just be crushing it. With R/W on the play, it's not much of a game really, and even with R/W on the draw, the games are still in favor of the 2-color deck. I think it's just a matter of consistency.

Haven't had any issues casting CttR with this mana base either.

I need to get some paper games in today though, to make sure it's not just Cockatrice's shuffler giving me the nuts every game or something. I also need to figure out what Kevin Jones sideboard plan would be, and how I can attack it in games 2 and 3.


After that, I'll be testing matches against RUG Tempo, MGD, and Abzan if I can find someone who actually has it sleeved today. So far, the deck seems pretty solid, really straightforward lines of play, and just consistent.

I think Ride Down is a fine substitute if 10 Mountains won't get you there as often as you want.

I really hate that card, and I'm not sure why.

I'd rather play the exile 3+ toughness enchantment myself if I were looking to substitute Chained in the MD - it hits pretty much the same targets (because how often are 1-2 toughness creatures getting Chained?) and allows you to switch gears to a more controlling role if needed, unlike Ride Down.

Ride down is insane. Rune 3 mainboard and never look back folks.

Ride down is insane. Rune 3 mainboard and never look back folks.

What happens when you are behind, and have 2 of these in your hand? Not to mention, as soon as someone realizes that you are playing it, they probably won't be blocking any more Rabble tokens with their Polukranos.

I much prefer Suspension Field in decks that you can't play CttR. The card actually does something when you have an empty board.

Both have their drawbacks. You can't Suspension Field a smaller dude which could be something you need to do in some games. It also gets blown up by enchantment removal which will likely come in postboard from the decks that you really want Suspension Field against. Typically if you are behind against the decks you'd want Suspension Field for, it being a better topdeck than Ride Down is likely irrelevant because you are not likely to win from behind with this deck anyway.

Both have their drawbacks. You can't Suspension Field a smaller dude which could be something you need to do in some games. It also gets blown up by enchantment removal which will likely come in postboard from the decks that you really want Suspension Field against. Typically if you are behind against the decks you'd want Suspension Field for, it being a better topdeck than Ride Down is likely irrelevant because you are not likely to win from behind with this deck anyway.

Sometimes they just have to block or you win....It fits the general purpose of the deck better. If you're behind you're behind and probably going to lose anyway. Can always side em out for deflecting palms or something second game when they know you run em. *in reference to ride down*

http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdat ... ckID=73706

[deck]
4 Akroan Crusader
4 Favored Hoplite
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Phalanx Leader
4 Satyr Hoplite

3 Mountain
5 Plains
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Mana Confluence
4 Temple of Triumph

4 Dragon Mantle
3 Hammerhand
1 Coordinated Assault
4 Defiant Strike
4 Gods Willing
4 Launch the Fleet

Sideboard
3 Lagonna-Band Trailblazer
3 Seeker of the Way
3 Suspension Field
2 Magma Spray
3 Brimaz, King of Oreskos
1 Arc Lightning[/deck]

I'm hoping to be able to test this one out on Thursday:

[deck]
Lands (23)
4 Battlefield Forge
4 Temple of Triumph
1 Wind-Scarred Crag
12 Mountain
2 Plains

Creatures (20)
4 Monastery Swiftspear
4 Seeker of the Way
4 Borderland Marauder
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
2 Ashcloud Phoenix
2 Iroas, God of Victory

Spells (17)
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Lightning Strike
2 Magma Jet
3 Chained to the Rocks
3 Hordeling Outburst
1 Hall of Triumph

Sideboard
1 Hall of Triumph
2 Harness by Force
1 Chained to the Rocks
2 Banishing Light
2 Purphoros, God of the Forge
1 Mountain
1 Ashcloud Phoenix
3 Arc Lightning
2 Magma Spray
[/deck]

I still want to try those Iroas, just so I can lay them to rest if they turn out a dud. Seeker of the Way might be better of as something else. The deck might be a bit all of the place, but we'll see.

Edit: Hall of Triumph might be better of as a Magma Jet, because of the Seekers.

This took second place in a local tournament (big pricepool, so good players but only 55 of them):

[deck]4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Akroan Hoplite
4 Goblin Rabblemaster
4 Ashcloud Phoenix
4 Wingmate Roc

4 Chained to the Rocks
4 Hordeling Outburst
4 Stoke the Flames
4 Lightning Strike

4 Temple of Triumph
4 Battlefield Forge
2 Wind-Scarred Crag
10 Mountain
4 Plains

Sideboard:
3 Banishing Light
3 Eidolon of the Great Revel
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
1 Hammer of Purphoros
1 Suspension Field
2 Chandra, Pyromaster
3 End Hostilities
1 Wind-Scarred Crag[/deck]

I like Akroan Hoplite in that list.

i kinda think this list would be ten times better in mardu.
and why would anyone play roc over stormbreath or sarkhan... people still overestimate this card. its good in abzan, cause no alternatives... but stormbreath and sarkhan are just better..

The list plays Wingmate Roc because it's a two for one almost all the time. The theme of the deck is to present more targets than the opponent can handle, so Wingmate gets the nod.