Combo[Primer] U/R Storm

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[Primer] U/R Storm

Post #1 by Khaospawn » Wed Oct 30, 2013 2:55 am

Well since nobody has done it yet, please allow me to start what will be the first Modern Storm Primer.

Khaos's Storm
[deck=Khaos's Storm]
Creatures 4
4 Goblin Electromancer

Enchantment 4
4 Pyromancer Ascension

Win-Con 4
2 Grapeshot
2 Lightning Bolt


Gimme Fuel, Gimme Fire... 30
3 Past In Flames
3 Faithless Looting
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
4 Manamorphose
4 Pyretic Ritual
4 Desperate Ritual

Land 18
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Steam Vents
1 Mountain
3 Island
3 Shivan Reef

Sideboard 15
2 Defense Grid
3 Empty the Warrens
2 Echoing Truth
2 Shatterstorm
2 Lightning Bolt
2 Blood Moon
2 Anger of the Gods
[/deck]


Okay, so a decklist in a thread does not a Primer make. But allow me to reveal what has currently been the Gold Standard for recent Storm decks:

[deck=Jon Finkel's Storm 9th-
16th GP Portland]
Creatures 4
4 Goblin Electromancer

Enchantment 4
4 Pyromancer Ascension

Win-Cons 3
3 Grapeshot

Gimme Fuel, Gimme Fire... 33
1 Peer Through Depths
2 Increasing Vengeance
3 Past in Flames
3 Desperate Ravings
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
4 Manamorphose
4 Pyretic Ritual
4 Desperate Ritual

Land 16
4 Scalding Tarn
2 Misty Rainforest
2 Steam Vents
3 Island
1 Mountain
1 Cascade Bluffs
3 Shivan Reef

Sideboard 15
1 Dispel
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Empty the Warrens
3 Shatterstorm
2 Defense Grid
2 Leyline of Sanctity
[/deck]

[deck=Pro Tour Born of the Gods Top 8 by Christopher Fennell]
Creatures 3
3 Goblin Electromancer

Enchantment 4
4 Pyromancer's Ascension

Spells 35
2 Lightning Bolt
3 Grapeshot
3 Past in Flames
3 Faithless Looting
4 Manamorphose
4 Desperate Ritual
4 Pyretic Ritual
4 Gitaxian Probe
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand

Land 18
3 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Shivan Reef
3
Steam Vents

Sideboard 15
2 Anger of the Gods
3 Defense Grid
1 Echoing Truth
3 Empty the Warrens
1 Lightning Bolt
3 Swan Song
2 Torpor Orb
[/deck]

[deck=Pro Tour Born of the Gods by Jon Finkel]
Creatures 4
4 Goblin Electromancer

Enchantment 4
4 Pyromancer Ascension

Spells 36
3 Desperate Ravings
4 Desperate Ritual
4 Gitaxian Probe
2 Grapeshot
4 Manamorphose
3 Past in Flames
4 Pyretic Ritual
4 Serum Visions
4 Sleight of Hand
4 Thought Scour

Land 16
3 Island
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
3 Shivan Reef
2 Steam Vents

Sideboard 15
3 Blood Moon
1 Defense Grid
1 Echoing Truth
3 Empty the Warrens
4 Lightning Bolt
3 Shatterstorm
[/deck]


The point of Storm is to play all the spells. Make tons of mana, draw tons of cards, and then deliver lethal damage with Grapeshot or with a swarm of Goblins, courtesy of Empty the Warrens. Past in Flames turns your Graveyard into an extra (and gigantic) hand, and an active Pyromancer
Ascension is the equivalent of throwing an ocean of gasoline on an already raging wildfire. Once you're on a roll, it's hard to stop. Eventually, you draw the majority of your deck and play everything you have, killing your opponent in the process.

The neat thing about Storm is that you can actually go off as early as Turn 3, provided you have the extremely helpful Goblin Electromancer (Dobby!) online. In rare cases, it can be Turn 2 unaided.

So how do you “go off?” Well, it's simple. And complicated. The basics involve having enough gas (draw) and fuel (mana) to play all the spells available, culminating in a giant Storm count which will either bury your opponent with direct damage from a Grapeshot or a horde of Goblins from an Empty the Warrens.

However, I'm not going to lie to you. You will have games where you never get a chance to do “all the cool stuff.” Sometimes you'll win by attacking with a few Goblin Electromancers and slinging some Burn (Magma Jet). Sometimes you'll win because
your opponent will burn themselves out from their own manabase, allowing you to Grapeshot for a measly 3-4 damage.

And sometimes you just won't win at all.

The key to winning with Storm is finding your lines of play and sequencing them in just the right order to achieve maximum payoff. You win by playing your deck as perfectly as possible.

Also, a little luck helps also.

A good Storm player will be able to goldfish an opponent in a short amount of time. But a great Storm player will be able to change his gameplan and adapt to his opponent's interactions. Judging when the time is right to deviate from the standard Goldfish plan is what will separate the men from the boys.

But you're probably asking yourself, “What the hell, Khaos? I understand what the deck is going to do, but when are you going to teach me to become a man? Er...play the Perfect Storm???”

Storm is one of those “abstract” decks. There really is no “linear” play to it, aside from wanting an early Electromancer and/or
Pyromancer Ascension. Mulligans will be aggressive, however. What you want is a solid mix of cantrips and library manipulation, a la Scry and Sleight of Hand, and some amount of fuel in the form of your Rituals. What really gives the deck its kick is the Electromancer since it allows you to play your spells at a cheaper cost, allowing you to cast more shenanigans. Pyromancer Ascension, when online, contributes tremendous value by copying your spells-

Wait, you mean, I can pay 2 life for a Gitaxian Probe and draw two cards after I peek at my opponent's hand???

Yes, Virginia. You absolutely can.

Just note that “copied” spells do NOT count for your Storm count.

However, you will rarely get there by going Turn 1 Serum Visions, Turn 2 Pyromancer Ascension, Turn 3 Goblin Electromancer with a double Manamorphose + Serum Visions into infinity.

What will happen, more often than not, is that you'll keep hands based on this “nut” opener, only to be disrupted into oblivion by
your Jund or U/W/R opponent.

And then what will you do?

What I will do for you is explain each card's role in the deck and how you can use them outside the Goldfish scenarios into obtaining a victory, and what makes my adjustments to the "current" Gold Standard better for the archetype.

So put your thinking caps on and be prepared to dive in. I must warn you beforehand – this Primer is not for the lazy minds. And if you can make it past this Primer, then be prepared to rack your brain even further when playing the Goldfish game. If you can make it past that, you just may have the mental fortitude to play against a real opponent that is capable of disrupting, and worse, beating you.

You have been warned.

A Storm Is Brewing...

Storm is a deck that aims to win by sequencing a series of spells to attain a huge 'Storm' count. The final blow is delivered by a Grapeshot pointed at you opponent's head,
making a horde of goblin tokens with Empty the Warrens, or by playing enough Lightning Bolts (via copy effects) aimed at your opponent. This is all made possible by three effects: an engine, fuel, and a win-condition.

Listen to That Kitten Purr...

The two most effective Storm engines in Modern are Goblin Electromancer and [card]Pyromancer's Ascension.[/card] Having either one of these on the battlefield greatly increases your chance of winning by allowing you to effectively gain more mileage out of your fuel cards. Sure, it's possible to Storm out without these, but your game will be so much easier with these two cards on board. The third engine for the deck is Past in Flames, a card that turns your gigantic graveyard into an extension of your hand and allows you to reuse every piece of gas you've already consumed.

[card]Goblin
Electromancer[/card]: This nifty little 2-drop is incredibly fragile, but can almost single-handedly win a game for you by reducing the cast of your Ritual cards by one. Suddenly, your Manamorphoses are netting you mana, and your Desperate Rituals are now Dark Rituals (albeit in Red). With Past in Flames now being able to be cast of a single Ritual, it's pretty feasible to be able to combo out on Turn 3.

[card]Pyromancer's Ascension[/card]: Ideally, this is the card you'd love to have out on turn 2. Pyromancer's Ascension rewards you for playing your spells early and often, and, after accumulating enough tokens to make it active, will allow you to draw cards and make mana like a fiend. With each Ritual essentially adding double the mana and your cantrips drawing you 2+ cards, it's almost impossible to lose. The only downside is that the copied spells themselves don't count towards your Storm count, but who
cares? A Manamorphose that adds 4 mana and draws 2 cards is usually good enough to find you more gas to play more spells anyway.

Past in Flames:After playing out a stream of cantrips and Rituals, sometimes you'll inevitably fizzle out. Past in Flames allows you to reuse everything you've already played, allowing you to continue your Storm. Here's a point to remember: Past in Flames is a 'time stamp' card, meaning that when you cast it, it only sees the cards in your graveyard at the time the spell resolves. Basically, upon resolution, Past in Flames looks at the cards currently in your graveyard and grants them flashback and any new cards that are added don't gain that ability (unless you cast another Past in Flames to grant the new cards Flashback). A nifty thing that Past in Flames allows you to do is a trick to turn on your Pyromancer's Ascension. For example, if you've cast two Gitaxian Probes (or
any other card) and accumulated a counter on your Ascension, you can play Past in Flames to flashback one of the Probes from your graveyard to gain a second counter on your Ascension, which turns it “on.” Flashback the second Probe, copy it, and start going to town.

Gimme Fuel, Gimme Fire, Gimme That Which I Desire!

Fuel for the deck is divided into two categories: cantrips and rituals. Rituals provide mana for you to cast cantrips, which draw you into more cards allowing you to cast more rituals and cantrips.

Cantrips

Here is a list of the most commonly played cantrips in Storm. Typically, a Storm deck wants about 12-16 of these cards.

Gitaxian Probe: A “free” cantrip most of the time. It's especially good in that it allows you gain information about the opponent's gameplan, which can be crucial when timing
your big turn to go off.

Serum Visions: A solid 1 cost spell that can set up the next draw you'll make.

Sleight of Hand: Another 1 cost spell that draws you a card. It can be a tricky deciding on which card to take with it, but for better or for worse, Sleight of Hand lets you dig a little deeper than your average “draw a card” cantrip.

Thoughtscour: A new addition to Modern Storm decks. Not only does it draw you card, but it helps fill up your graveyard for a big Past in Flames play.

Desperate Ravings: Two mana to draw 2 cards is pretty good, even with the 'discard 1 card at random' clause. Hey, you'll be casting Past in Flames later, right? Desperate Ravings even has flashback too!

Faithless Looting: This card requires a higher land count than most Storm decks, but it allows you filter out your draws by chucking your excess lands.
When the card is good, it's great. When you're attempting to Storm with a small hand, be careful, as the card can actually provide a disadvantage, but even so, Past in Flames somewhat allows you to overcome this drawback.


Rituals

Pyretic Ritual: Two mana to make three mana doesn't seem like much, but the deck is very mana hungry. Mana makes the word go 'round, and when you're discounting this spell with an Electromancer or copying it with [card]Pyromancer's Ascension[/card], it adds up real fast.

Desperate Ritual: This is a 'strictly' better Pyretic Ritual when you consider that you can 'splice' it onto another Desperate Ritual to make even more mana. Yay for mo mana!

The Best Of Both Worlds

Manamorphose: This card does it all – it fixes your
mana to cast more blue spells, it draws a card, and when discounted, it actually creates more mana. When copied, this spell does so much work for you. Hands down, it is easily the best source of fuel for your deck. It's usually a good idea to save this card for your big turn, but considering its power level within the deck, there's never a bad time to cast this spell.

Win Conditions

Grapeshot: This is your 'go-to' card for your win. Aim it at the face for damage or split it up to clear your opponent's threats to buy some more time. When the spell is copied, it can get a little confusing, but remember this: if your opponent counters it, the copies are also on the stack, so unless your opponent has a ton of mana and a ton of counterspells, you're going to get value from it. Just be aware that the 'storm' copies don't get copied from an active Ascension.

[card]Empty the Warrens[/
card]: This is your alternate win-condition. Usually relegated to the sideboard to be swapped out in other matches (like when you anticipate an opposing Leyline of Sanctity in Game 2), Empty the Warrens can also be maindecked in a small number to provide some pressure to your opponent. The same 'storm' rules that apply to Grapeshot apply to this little token-making card as well.

Lightning Bolt: Usually found in the sideboard as an answer to fast creature decks, this card can also be maindecked to great success. When copied, it's almost as efficient as Grapeshot when it comes to killing your opponent.

Manabase:

A typical Storm deck needs very little land to operate since it makes most of the mana it needs with Rituals. Sixteen lands is usually the right the number since the deck has access to fetch lands like Scalding Tarn and [card]Misty
Rainforest[/card]. Players that want to run Faithless Looting will generally want to run 17-18 land in order to pitch the excess to the 'discard 2' clause.

Currently, the norm is usually a full set of each blue-based fetchland, a small number of Steam Vents, Shivan Reefs, Islands, and a single Mountain. Other choices to consider are a singleton of Cascade Bluffs or Sulfur Falls.

Words of Wisdom from the Wise Ones:

http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/taking-modern-by-storm/

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28027_The-Worst-Kept-Secret-In-Modern.html

http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/valencia-report/

-Primer to be finished at the author's convenience-
Last edited by Khaospawn on Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:08 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #2 by Jack » Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:16 am

I always enjoy reading your primers, Khaos, and this one was no exception. This might be my favorite deck in Modern that I'll never build. It uses my two favorite colors, and the artwork for each and every card is just so sick.

One thing your primer is lacking: an oversized version of the artwork for Past in Flames (is that Olivia in the picture, or just a random devil?) or Pyromancer Ascension.
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Post #3 by Khaospawn » Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:24 am

I'll get to all that at some point. Weirdly enough, I didn't understand the scope of what I began until I'd already started writing.

This is going to take a lot of writing. I actually should've made a few "reserved posts," but I'm sure a mod can help me with that if it comes to it.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #4 by NerdBoyWonder » Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:12 am

I'll knock out a banner soon for you Khaos. Storm was one of my favorite decks prior to the Seething Song bannings and has been hard for me to pick up and pilot again.
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Post #5 by LP, of the Fires » Wed Oct 30, 2013 9:13 am

Yeah, writing a storm primer would be a lot of work. Ari lax writes about it about 2/4 times a year for Legacy, and the Legacy deck is a lot simpler oddly enough because it's drastically more powerful, has been around forever, and you play a compact 3/4 win cons with the rest of your deck being 3 different affects(draw, mana, disruptions).

Modern storm plays actual creatures, your filtering is horrible, you have your kill spell and you kill spell aid of which you have to play multiple of each, and you get zero disruption meaning you have to time your kill very carefully while racing both your and your opponents manabase in a sense.

Yeah, I don't envy you, but appreciate the work your doing and I imagine it will be very satisfying once finished.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Post #6 by TubeHunter » Wed Oct 30, 2013 5:35 pm

I feel sorry when i look at modern storm...
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Post #7 by NerdBoyWonder » Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:13 am

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GIFTS!
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Post #8 by Jack » Thu Oct 31, 2013 3:25 am

Beautiful. It even has goblins!
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Post #9 by Mcdonalds » Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:05 am

LP, of the Fires » Wed Oct 30, 2013 2:13 am wrote:Yeah, writing a storm primer would be a lot of work. Ari lax writes about it about 2/4 times a year for Legacy, and the Legacy deck is a lot simpler oddly enough because it's drastically more powerful, has been around forever, and you play a compact 3/4 win cons with the rest of your deck being 3 different affects(draw, mana, disruptions).

Modern storm plays actual creatures, your filtering is horrible, you have your kill spell and you kill spell aid of which you have to play multiple of each, and you get zero disruption meaning you have to time your kill very carefully while racing both your and your opponents manabase in a sense.

Yeah, I don't envy you, but appreciate the work your doing and I imagine it will be very satisfying once
finished.


Storm (and by extension combo in general, be it modern or legacy..or vintage for that matter), isn't itself hard to play, if your able to do basic math in your head, and count, usually your set.

It's when your opponent starts bluffing countermagic/disruption is when it gets hard.

That being said, looks like a solid start for a primer.

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Post #10 by LP, of the Fires » Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:47 am

Legacy storm is easy to play most of the time as you have on average 1/6th of your deck which you can use to look at there hand.

Modern storm is hard because your opponents disruption is on par with legacy's(no force, but ain't no ANT players 'bout to lose to force) while your library manipulation is BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Post #11 by Khaospawn » Thu Oct 31, 2013 8:20 am

@Nerdboy- bad ass! I'll use it!

@McDonald's- thanks. I'm going to wrote some more today after work.

@LP- agreed.
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Post #12 by Mcdonalds » Fri Nov 01, 2013 5:25 am

LP, of the Fires » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:47 pm wrote:Legacy storm is easy to play most of the time as you have on average 1/6th of your deck which you can use to look at there hand.

Modern storm is hard because your opponents disruption is on par with legacy's(no force, but ain't no ANT players 'bout to lose to force) while your library manipulation is BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD.


Depends on the variant, there is like 5 different storm decks in legacy and only 3 of them play any sort of protection/hand disruption (the other 2 being Belcher and Spanish Inquisition)

I would argue it's comprable, your cantrips are much worse, but the disruption in modern isn't nearly as potent as it is in Legacy (It's not FoW that ANT is scared of it's delver backed with Force, Daze, Wasteland and Stifle,
that is legitimately terrifying for a storm player).

Again, It's once you start having to play around disruption that separates the men from the boys.

I'll give you this, Modern Storm is definately harder than Belcher, and probably ANT (on par at least)

but I digress.

For discussion, I distinctly remember there being a variant of this that played Gifts Ungiven which looked pretty sweet (partially cause Gifts is a sweet card), then the Seething Song ban happened, and it kinda disappeared, anyone done anything with that variant or is it pretty much dead?

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Post #13 by Jack » Fri Nov 01, 2013 9:10 pm

Khaos, I goldfished your list a few times on Cockatrice, and I've formed the opinion that I want Desperate Ravings back in the deck. Magma Jet is cool, but being able to draw cards is so critical to our game plan. Desperate Ravings is key because you can cast it from your graveyard at the points where you can't find a certain piece of your combo and are likely to fizzle. It can also help you to regain a chance at winning a game if you fizzled last turn. Maybe you went all-in without a win-con, hoping you would draw one out of all those cantrips, but you didn't. A timely Desperate Ravings finding a Past in Flames (or, even better, cantrips that lead to Past in Flames) just feels so good.

Keep in mind that this all comes from a few goldfish games, but it's just something that I noticed and felt the need to say something about.
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Post #14 by NerdBoyWonder » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:11 pm

I'm partial to faithless looting over desperate ravings. DR draws you cards but I've been on the bad end of DR far too often. Faithless Looting sets up Pyromancer's Ascension and does let you dig.
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Post #15 by Jack » Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:02 pm

Either one would work, I would just like to have a draw spell with flashback.
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Post #16 by Khaospawn » Sat Nov 02, 2013 6:52 pm

I need to get some more writing in.

Faithless Looting > Desperate Ravings all day. Like NerdBoy, I too, have been on the bad end of DR.

But, in order to support Faithless Looting, you have to up your land count to 18. This ensures that you can hit your drops, as well have things to pitch as you draw into more gas.

However, I've been finding that the disruption from the B/G/x decks really put a stranglehold on the combo plan. Thoughtseize and DRS can be backbreaking. I need to further update my list, but I've been trying out 17 land and 4 Magma Jet to combat these menaces. Magma Jet helps in that you can kill a Shaman and Scry, which is actually very beneficial when they want to Thoughtseize you. They can't pluck the gas from your hand if its on top of your deck.

I must add, that while Faithless Looting is awesome in helping you go off, you have to understand that in most games you will encounter resistance.
Not every game will be a goldfish game. However, I encourage everyone starting off with Storm to play solitaire with the deck as often as you can so you can really develop a feel for the way each card interacts.

For example, in goldfish games, I find that yes, you can make a billion goblins with Empty the Warrens very early. But once you face off against Jund (as an example), you'll see that its actually beneficial to make 4-6 Goblins to stave off Tarmogoyfs and have sac fodder for when Liliana hits the table. You want to keep your Electromancer from being sacrificed and use those Goblins to pressure Liliana. The few turns Warrens buys you are so valuable for when you need to manipulate the next turn or two. It let's you set up for the big Past in Flames finish.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #17 by NerdBoyWonder » Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:03 pm

Makes sense. Going to have to sleeve this thing back up and see how it goes.

Playing through hate reminds me of the games I played prior to the seething song ban. Upset a local player because his sideboard was dedicated to hate me out and he expected me to conceed when it went to postboard. We tied or I still won.
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Post #18 by Khaospawn » Sat Nov 02, 2013 9:52 pm

Pre ban Seething Song Storm was just nuts. I actually decided to make the deck once I saw Epic Experiment in the lists. Like, holy shit, really? With an active Ascension, you literally dump half your library over and cast EVERYTHING, thanks to Epic Experiment. Sadly, two days after I completed the deck, the madness enabler that is Seething Song was banned. :(
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #19 by NerdBoyWonder » Sun Nov 03, 2013 8:45 am

Khaospawn » Sat Nov 02, 2013 1:52 pm wrote:Pre ban Seething Song Storm was just nuts. I actually decided to make the deck once I saw Epic Experiment in the lists. Like, holy shit, really? With an active Ascension, you literally dump half your library over and cast EVERYTHING, thanks to Epic Experiment. Sadly, two days after I completed the deck, the madness enabler that is Seething Song was banned. :(


Storm got me into competitive modern. I HAD found my deck. Playing storm felt like I was channelling one giant Hadouken against my opponent. The banned happen and have been struggling to get the deck to work and find another modern deck. I main robots now but with the dominant deck in our meta being American,
pre ban storm would do me wonders.

I could play RUG Scapeshift. Beating people by playing mountains is in my nature but could just beat them with mountains seems cool too.
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Post #20 by LP, of the Fires » Wed Feb 26, 2014 12:58 am

http://www.channelfireball.com/articles ... chs-storm/

Relevant for all the storm enthusiasts.
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Post #21 by Valdarith » Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:19 am

I like the addition of Thought Scour here.
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Post #22 by Valdarith » Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:28 am

I'm also glad I picked up all the staples for this deck before they skyrocketed. Got my Past in Flames and Pyromancer Ascensions at $1 each! Will be nice to pilot this when I want a break from UR Delver.
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Post #23 by Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:09 pm

Storm is incredibly fun, but also incredibly frustrating when the deck decides it just doesn't want to work. Still, with that said, the amount of decisions you make when piloting Storm is immense and, when you win, it just feels that much better. Finkel made a good point in his article about the decision making process and I, too, still find myself analyzing plays and decisions even from games I had played just a few weeks ago.
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Post #24 by Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:11 pm

But yeah, Val, if you've played U/R Delver for this long, I'd say the next step to take is to play Storm. You've already familiarized yourself with some very complex decision trees from the Delver deck.
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Post #25 by Valdarith » Wed Feb 26, 2014 4:54 pm

Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:11 am wrote:But yeah, Val, if you've played U/R Delver for this long, I'd say the next step to take is to play Storm. You've already familiarized yourself with some very complex decision trees from the Delver deck.


If the meta shifts more toward Zoo strategies which Delver is traditionally weak to, I may be forced to play Storm anyway. I've been thinking of ways to tune Delver to beat Zoo but haven't come up with a solid strategy yet.

FWIW I enjoy goldfishing my Sac Land Tendrils deck (never actually played it because no one plays Legacy here) and I've goldfished Modern Storm as well. Both are pretty difficult to pilot which I enjoy. I tend to prefer more interactive decks like Delver but sometimes I just like doing unfair things.
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Post #26 by Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 5:04 pm

I've spent hours goldfishing Storm. It's literally my favorite way to kill time at the house if I have about 10-15 minutes to spare.

I just reread that last sentence and I realize how much of a nerd I sound like.
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Post #27 by Platypus » Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:52 pm

I just ordered the three Past in Flames (everyone seems to play just three? or will I kick myself for not getting a playset?) I'm missing from UR Storm, before they skyrocket (they will go up...) Well, I'm missing one Manamorphose and three Desperate Rituals as well, but those aren't mythics...
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Post #28 by LP, of the Fires » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:16 pm

Valdarith » Wed Feb 26, 2014 8:54 am wrote:
Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:11 am wrote:But yeah, Val, if you've played U/R Delver for this long, I'd say the next step to take is to play Storm. You've already familiarized yourself with some very complex decision trees from the Delver deck.


If the meta shifts more toward Zoo strategies which Delver is traditionally weak to, I may be forced to play Storm anyway. I've been thinking of ways to tune Delver to beat Zoo but haven't come up with a solid strategy yet.

FWIW I enjoy goldfishing my Sac Land Tendrils deck (never actually played it because no one plays Legacy here) and I've goldfished Modern Storm as well. Both are
pretty difficult to pilot which I enjoy. I tend to prefer more interactive decks like Delver but sometimes I just like doing unfair things.


Threads of Disloyalty. Young Pyromancer's probably good as well. Board out most if not all of your counterspells. Maybe accomodate your manabase to include breeding pool/stomping ground to enable the full firespout(angers good as well since it's aweosome vs pod, but firespout lets you dodge your flipped delvers/cliques for the one sided wrath aspect.

Back to storm, the decks basically affinity lite. Will just beat you so long as you aren't packing sufficient hate or have an unreasoanbly fast clock. While Khaos durdles away at the primer( <3 ) one real quick piece of advice is that Goblin electromancer vs. decks with removal is often a 3 mana sorcery. When you cast him, you have priority letting you cast one discounted instant, and if they respond with removal, all of your ritualesque cards are instants letting you desperate/pyretic/
manamorphse your way to value you town with there bolt on the stack. Just make sure that when you do this, you either generate enough mana for a healthy past in flames, or you add enough blue with Manamophse to keep the chain going with your cantrips if it's the *OMG I'm so dead next turn* play.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Post #29 by Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:57 pm

Man, I should really finish this primer. :gonk:
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Post #30 by Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 9:58 pm

Platypus » Wed Feb 26, 2014 2:52 pm wrote:I just ordered the three Past in Flames (everyone seems to play just three? or will I kick myself for not getting a playset?) I'm missing from UR Storm, before they skyrocket (they will go up...) Well, I'm missing one Manamorphose and three Desperate Rituals as well, but those aren't mythics...

3 is the sweet spot, yes.
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Post #31 by Khaospawn » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:41 pm

I updated the Primer a little bit. This may take awhile before it's completely fleshed out.
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Post #32 by Platypus » Sat Mar 01, 2014 9:32 pm

Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:57 pm wrote:Man, I should really finish this primer. :gonk:


Yeah, I need to be a storm guru in little over a month's time. I have assembled the pieces and will probably play it in our local big Modern tournament with over 1000€ worth of stuff in the price pool...

In the meantime...can anyone link to some really good storm articles, preferably on the modern version of course.

Edit: In addition to that one written by Finkel...
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Post #33 by Khaospawn » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:41 pm

Platypus » Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:32 pm wrote:
Khaospawn » Wed Feb 26, 2014 11:57 pm wrote:Man, I should really finish this primer. :gonk:


Yeah, I need to be a storm guru in little over a month's time. I have assembled the pieces and will probably play it in our local big Modern tournament with over 1000€ worth of stuff in the price pool...

In the meantime...can anyone link to some really good storm articles, preferably on the modern version of course.

Edit: In addition to that one written by Finkel...

I haven't found any.

In my experience, it's one of those
decks that's really easy to explain, but pretty hard to master. Fortunately, it's one of those decks that you can literally goldfish a hundred times and it's still fun. The amount of decision making and gambling in any one game is staggering. But, like in solitaire, there will be games that you just won't win; however, the more adept you are with the deck, the more often you'll be able to 'see through' what looks to be an obvious losing game and find a way to win. Of course, the next level after goldfishing a million times is to actually play a game - it's one thing to mechanically be able to win with the deck and another to be able to fight through disruption, a quick clock, and dodge counters.

One thing I've learned is this, for me, I prefer the 17-18 land version with Faithless Looting. I feel like I have more control over my choices and my mulligans are more forgiving. Thought Scour is, theoretically, a perfect card for the deck: it cantrips, fills your yard for Past in Flames, and increases
the density of 1-mana draw spells. However, in the few games I've played this week with it, the mill for 2 actually screwed me up and I can't honestly say it actually improved the deck. The same goes for Desperate Ravings - on paper, DR is pure advantage; you can play it with no other cards in hand and still come out ahead. However, I've been bit one too many times in the ass by not having control over what I discard.

The beauty of Storm is that there is no wrong way to build it at the moment. As long as you have your core of Probe, Visions, and Slight for your cantrips, the 2 rituals + Manamorphose for your accelerants, the right amount of Grapeshot, Past in Flames, Ascension, and Electromancer, and the proper land count, you have a deck that is capable of winning. Use the few flex slots you have available when deckbuilding wisely and you can't go wrong.
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Post #34 by Platypus » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:29 pm

I just have to sleeve it up and start goldfishing. My limited playtesting opportunities makes storm a better choice for me than any other modern deck right now.

I'm going for a Faithless Looting variant, mostly because I don't have the Desperate Ravings right now and I must say that I prefer the more control discard. My manabase won't be perfect, but I can probably manage with what I got.

Oh, and I found this:

http://www.channelfireball.com/videos/c ... ern-storm/

Might be worth a look.
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Post #35 by Khaospawn » Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:19 pm

Great article on Storm on SCG! I'll link when I get home. Crazy how close Andrew Shout is to my assessment of the deck!
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Post #36 by Platypus » Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:22 pm

This one?

http://www.starcitygames.com/article/28 ... odern.html

I'll have a read-through tonight.

The videos I linked to were quite interesting, at least for a first-timer like me.
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Post #37 by Khaospawn » Wed Mar 05, 2014 1:33 pm

Yeah! He even prefers the Looting version.

I didn't know he was JohnnyHotSauce on MTGO. I've seen some of his lists.
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Post #38 by DroppinSuga » Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:53 am

Replying to subscribe. Consider me a fan of Storm.
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Post #39 by LP, of the Fires » Thu Mar 06, 2014 2:56 am

Sorry Khaos, preferred finkels list.

Maindecking bolt doesn't vibe with me as it's not a win-con, nor a cantrip.

18 lands feels like too many. I get that with faithless, you can ditch lands, but if you don't have the lands, looting is simply the worst kind of cantrip as it's not getting you ahead on cards. Thoughtscour as finkel said is almost 1.5 of a card drawn since it's fueling your ascensions. The idea of "milling gas" and being screwed over is fairly dumb by my way of thinking since scrys aside, milling from the top is the same as milling from the bottom.

Ravings is awesome because for you only tough matchups(blue decks) it's getting you ahead on cards which is what you want. With so much redundancy, the random discard shouldn't adversely affect you.
You gotta understand, I love the beatdown. I really do. I always have.

Beatdown is hard, though.


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Post #40 by Valdarith » Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:53 am

I'm in the Ravings camp as well.
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