Underground Sea (Legacy)[Deck] Burn

Discussions about the Legacy Format

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Post #961 by BlakLanner » Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:45 pm

Perhaps it looks odd to me because I have tried to get away from Lavaman for as long as I have been playing the deck. First fetchless with Devils, now with Swiftspears.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.


Currently Playing
Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here

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Post #962 by Valdarith » Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:52 pm

I assume you want to play Swiftspear for faster wins, but what matchups does it help you win that you aren't already favored against? It certainly isn't going to help your combo matchups as those are already bad, so why make your other matchups worse to ever so slightly improve hopeless ones?

The "stock" burn list is stock for a reason. It's the best configuration. Stop trying to reinvent the wheel and play the best configuration.
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Post #963 by BlakLanner » Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:55 pm

It is more that, for me, Lavamancer just dies without doing anything so damn often. At least Swiftspear gets a hit in. I also played 19 Mountains back then to Stifle-proof myself so had not a lot of food for him. If Elves stays this popular (Indy is a hotbed for it), I might have to just swallow my pride and put at least two in.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #964 by Mcdonalds » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:21 pm

Grim gives you game against Elves and Stoneforge Decks, whereas Taylor Swiftspear really doesn't , you don't have any free spells other than fireblast, no way to refill on gas making swiftspear dead very quickly.

Lavaman dying is fine, sure you get not value out of it, but it says more about how dangerous that card can be if unanswered, Elves has a rough time against that card if they can't power through it and it almost assuredly answers batterskull (via killing stoneforge)

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Post #965 by BlakLanner » Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:28 pm

Those are valid points. I will go back to testing after Regionals.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #966 by Khaospawn » Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:43 am

What's there to test??
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #967 by Valdarith » Tue Feb 03, 2015 3:46 am

YOU WILL PLAY LAVAMAN AND YOU WILL LIKE IT!
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Post #968 by Khaospawn » Tue Feb 03, 2015 4:02 am

Val pretty much has summed up what everyone has been thinking.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #969 by Khaospawn » Tue Feb 03, 2015 4:02 am

This is the intervention.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #970 by BlakLanner » Tue Feb 03, 2015 5:04 pm

Khaospawn » 02 Feb 2015 23:02 wrote:This is the intervention.


Do those ever work?

I will likely make the change eventually. I am just a stubborn bastard.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #971 by hamfactorial » Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:02 pm

BlakLanner, first off we want you to know we love you very much.

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Post #972 by Khaospawn » Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:26 pm

But this behavior you've exhibited......is hurting those around you....
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #973 by Mcdonalds » Tue Feb 03, 2015 11:37 pm

you need to stop suddenly doing jazz hands

It's becoming an issue

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Post #974 by hamfactorial » Wed Feb 04, 2015 12:48 am

I don't want to point fingers here... you're a problem.

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Post #975 by BlakLanner » Wed Feb 04, 2015 4:39 am

hamfactorial » 03 Feb 2015 17:02 wrote:BlakLanner, first off we want you to know we love you very much.

You actually had me laughing hard enough that the people at work thought I was having a seizure with this one.
Lord_Mcdonalds wrote:you need to stop suddenly doing jazz hands
It's becoming an issue

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hamfactorial wrote:I don't want to point fingers here... you're a problem.

I have been told that pretty much constantly since I was born.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #976 by hamfactorial » Wed Feb 04, 2015 5:49 am

:rofl:

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Post #977 by Jojja » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:00 pm

This is my 75 right now, it gets me away from the Lavamancers and gives me a more reliable turn 3 kill due to the DRS mana ramping. Sometimes the waselands can be a problem, but mostly folks tend to wasteland themselves to protect against Price so the mana has been working out. Anyone else on the Jund "Death-Burn" plan on here?

[deck]Land (20)

2x Badlands
4x Bloodstained Mire
4x Mountain
4x Scalding Tarn
2x Taiga
4x Wooded Foothills

Creature (12)

4x Deathrite Shaman
4x Eidolon of the Great Revel
4x Goblin Guide

Sorcery (16)

4x Chain Lightning
4x Lava Spike
4x Rift Bolt
4x Tyrant's Choice

Instant (10)

3x Fireblast
4x Lightning Bolt
3x Price of Progress

Enchantment (2)

1x Sulfuric Vortex
1x Sylvan Library

Sideboard (15)

3x Ensnaring Bridge
3x Faerie Macabre
3x Krosan Grip
2x Pyroblast
3x Searing Blood
1x Sulfuric Vortex

[/deck]

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Post #978 by BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:07 pm

I would advise against splashing in this deck, especially now that Wasteland is showing up in large numbers again. I do not believe that the benefits of DRS and Tyrant's Choice make up for the extra vulnerability.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #979 by Jojja » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:45 pm

Thats fair. I'll be trying it out for a few weeks at least. I think the mana ramp, grave hate and more efficient "lavamancer" will be worth it. Also I like having the option of gaining life in the mirror if needed :)

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Post #980 by BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:47 pm

While DRS is better at hitting players, Lavamancer's ability to hit creatures without costing cards is its real benefit.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #981 by Khaospawn » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:57 pm

I just can't imagine that deck being able to win against other Burn decks.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #982 by Jojja » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:08 pm

There are advantages and disadvantages. But I'm looking forward to testing it and trying to run it in a tournament that is comming up at the end of Feb. The real draw to the splashes are DRSs ability to mana ramp and giving me access to 3 mana on turn 2, 4 mana on turn 3 ect. The GY hate is also nice since there are a rather large number of reanimator decks in my area.

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Post #983 by BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:29 pm

Burn doesn't need any ramp. We tend to empty our hand after 3 turns as it is. I can understand your desire for graveyard hate if Reanimator is strong but you already have Macabre in the sideboard and have options like Tormod's Crypt or Relic of Progenitus. By all means feel free to test it but I think you will find it lacking compared to a more traditional configuration.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #984 by Khaospawn » Thu Feb 12, 2015 5:40 pm

That deck just doesn't have a good ways to deal with opposing DRS, Delvers and Stoneforge Mystics. It needs Lavamancer and Searing Blaze.

At least, that's my opinion.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #985 by BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:48 pm

On a side note from last weekend: Judge Bolts acquired. I am seriously considering breaking my rule on foil vs old card frame for the Chain Lightning and Price of Progress as well. I am honestly starting to worry about getting game losses for the only non-foil cards I have being in my sideboard though.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #986 by Khaospawn » Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:52 pm

When in doubt, ask a judge before you play.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #987 by BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:54 pm

I am a judge. I know all too well how varied their decisions on such things can be. The fact that I double sleeve will provide some insulation from the problem. I probably won't change them out anyway since I have had those Chain Lightnings since I started playing Magic back in the Ice Age era.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #988 by Khaospawn » Thu Feb 12, 2015 6:56 pm

Ask the head judge. Ultimately, its their call if you're in doubt.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #989 by Mcdonalds » Fri Feb 13, 2015 6:36 am

Pics damnit PICS

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Post #990 by Valdarith » Fri Feb 13, 2015 7:56 am

BlakLanner » Thu Feb 12, 2015 11:54 am wrote:I am a judge. I know all too well how varied their decisions on such things can be. The fact that I double sleeve will provide some insulation from the problem. I probably won't change them out anyway since I have had those Chain Lightnings since I started playing Magic back in the Ice Age era.


If I were this concerned I would ask the judge to look at my deck before the event and make a firm decision on it. If he thinks the cards could be considered marked, he should authorize appropriate proxy measures.
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Post #991 by Mcdonalds » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:09 pm

Provided you can't cut to them only the most anal judges are going to say anything and if you are concerned about warping, salt packets help with that (Think the ones you get in shoes)

Also PDS chains and prices are ghetto as fuck

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Post #992 by Khaospawn » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:34 pm

That's silica gel, not salt. Lol
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #993 by BlakLanner » Fri Feb 13, 2015 11:46 pm

Lord_Mcdonalds » 13 Feb 2015 18:09 wrote:Also PDS chains and prices are ghetto as fuck


Another reason to stick with the originals. I think I will do so. This deck is also a story of my history in Magic. I should do it the honor it deserves and keep the originals.
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #994 by Mcdonalds » Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:55 am

Khaospawn » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:34 pm wrote:That's silica gel, not salt. Lol


Silica gel, salt, acetone, same thing

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Post #995 by hamfactorial » Sat Feb 14, 2015 3:15 am

Lord_Mcdonalds » Fri Feb 13, 2015 3:55 pm wrote:
Khaospawn » Fri Feb 13, 2015 5:34 pm wrote:That's silica gel, not salt. Lol


Silica gel, salt, acetone, same thing

They're all anthems, stop being picky

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Post #996 by BlakLanner » Sat Feb 14, 2015 11:47 pm



Fine, fine. I can't get decent lighting with everything closed up for the cold but here you go.

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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #997 by Khaospawn » Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:17 am

All I see is a bunch of bad red cards.

;)
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #998 by BlakLanner » Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:21 am

Ok, Kait.
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MTGO/Cockatrice: BlakLanner
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Khaospawn » 08 Jul 2014 15:45 wrote:BlakLanner is the boogeyman created to scare the little Standard players.




Currently Playing


Standard: [mana]RWU[/mana]Jeskai
Modern: [mana]RWG[/mana]Burn, [mana]GRWUR[/mana]Slivers
Legacy: [mana]R[/mana]Burn
EDH: [mana]RWGUB[/mana]Sliver Overlord, [mana]UW[/mana]Geist of Saint Traft (Tiny Leaders)
Current decklists are posted here


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Post #999 by Khaospawn » Sun Feb 15, 2015 1:08 am

There is no Kait, only Zuul.
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hamfactorial » Tue Nov 25, 2014 1:41 pm wrote:In a pinch, Khaos' beard can help turn this around.

Col. Khaddafi » Thu Jul 04, 2013 6:02 pm wrote:I rarely skip a Khaospawn wall of text because I know there is always piss at the end of the rainbow.

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Post #1000 by Mcdonalds » Sun Feb 15, 2015 4:04 am

Next step: pack foil goblin guides ;)


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