Underground Sea (Legacy)[Deck] Shardless BUG

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[Deck] Shardless BUG

Post #1 by Mcdonalds » Mon May 12, 2014 12:12 am

[Deck]
Creatures:
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shardless Agent
2 Baleful Strix

Instands/Sorceries:
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Ancestral Vision
2 Toxic Deluge
1 Maelstrom Pulse

Planeswalkers:
3 Liliana of the Veil
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Land:
4 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
4 Polluted Delta
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Verdant Catacomb
3 Wasteland
1 Creeping Tar-Pit

Sideboard:
1 Scrubland
4 Meddling Mage
4 Thoughtseize
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Graftdigger's Cage
1 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Pithing Needle
1 Golgari Charm
1 Engineered Plague
[/Deck]

List I've been playing for the past 2 months

Gonna try

-1 Pulse
+1 Library

and then prolly redo the sideboard (I literally have nothing to side in, course I play against delver most of the time and score free wins so meh), keeping the mages/thoughtseizes

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Post #2 by rcwraspy » Thu Nov 13, 2014 6:45 pm

If you're like me, you've probably switched from Shardless BUG to BUG Delver now that Treasure Cruise is around, right?
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Post #3 by Mcdonalds » Thu Nov 13, 2014 7:33 pm

I just switched to elves, UR delver 2 gud

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Post #4 by Mcdonalds » Sun Jan 25, 2015 4:38 am

[Deck]
Creatures
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shardless Agent

Spells
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Ancestral Vision
3 Hymn to Tourach
2 Thoughtseize
2 Dig Through Time

3 Liliana of the Veil

Lands
4 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Wasteland


Sideboard
1 Null Rod
1 Creeping Tar-Pit
1 Golgari Charm
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Nihil SpellBomb
2 Disfigure
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Thoughtseize
1 Night of Souls' Betrayal
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Graftdigger's Cage
1 Sylvan Library
1 Vendilion Clique
[/Deck]

Back to good ol' shardless BUG

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Post #5 by rcwraspy » Sun Jan 25, 2015 4:48 am

yeah i sleeved mine back up yesterday. of course, in the interim i've forgotten what i landed on as my best MD and SB configurations, so I'll have to look to see what the meta looks like right now.

I really like a couple baleful strix and at least 1 jace in the main. also think my cap on lili is 2. what are the reasons for your numbers?
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Post #6 by Mcdonalds » Sun Jan 25, 2015 5:17 am

I tend to forget about Baleful Strix when I draw up lists for this deck, I also began cutting it as I really like Toxic Deluge/Golgari Charm in this deck.

I think I've always played 3 lily in this deck and has been fine, never really felt I should go to 2 nor go to 4, I want her in any fair match up, and even against unfair decks, while not the best, turn 2 lily is remarkably solid, nevermind chaining them together for insane value

Wanted to try Dig over Jace. I've only ever felt jace was good in this deck when I'm either even or ahead of my opponent, where as (in my experience) dig is never really bad if you resolve it, may just be jace is better but eh. Also being able to hit my sideboard cards postboard with dig (when I resolve it, I'd be amazed if I don't see one in the 7 cards I look at) when I need to seems good.

3 Hymn/ 2 Thoughtseize: Buddy of mine tried it and said it was great so I wanted to give it a try, also every time I've lost in the mirror, that person was using that exact configuration and I tire of losing the mirror (which I imagine I'm going to run into more)

rest is pretty self explanitory

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Post #7 by Mcdonalds » Sun Jan 25, 2015 5:20 am

Although with no Jace, 2 Needle in the board maybe better than 1 Null Rod/1 WhateverIcutforNeedle2....then again I don't have japaense pithing needles and I do have a japanese null rod

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Post #8 by rcwraspy » Sun Jan 25, 2015 6:28 am

If you're not running Jace then the urge to run Needle is definitely a lot stronger. It can also shut down a Jitte, which is really where Null Rod shines in Legacy, but of course has broader application. I run a 2/2 split of Jace and Lili though so I usually don't have Needle in the board. I'll post my list tomorrow.

Also, are you preparing for more reanimator and other combo coming into this "new" post-Cruise meta? It's why I decided on 4 FOW in the main and I see you've done that too, whereas in the past many lists ran 3 main 1 side.
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Post #9 by Mcdonalds » Sun Jan 25, 2015 6:38 am

There are maybe 1-2 people in my meta that play reanimator as a large majority of the people either a) do not own the deck, b) think the deck is awful or both, and of those 2, I can never really be sure what one is on (dude owns literally everything...in foil as well), and the other sometimes plays (although he is almost assuredly on reanimator), I'm more worried about burn but honestly there isn't much to be done about that MU so I just suck it up and move on

I anticipate more BUG Variants and Miracles in my meta, combo has never been popular (although for larger events I'd take the Meddling Mage package), I like 4 FOW as it allows me to tap out and still have countermagic ready, given Shardless is now the only deck in the meta with a draw 3 effect, aggressively using force is fine, and I even tend to keep it in fair MUs when people don't expect it, especially in the Miracles MU.

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Post #10 by rcwraspy » Sun Jan 25, 2015 5:25 pm

So here's what I slapped together 2 days ago to create a starting point for rebuilding the deck. Obviously will need to change some things around, but I think it's a fine starting point.

[deck]
Creatures - 14
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Baleful Strix
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shardless Agent

Instants - 14
4 Brainstorm
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Force of Will
2 Dig Through Time

Sorceries - 8
3 Hymn To Tourach
2 Thoughtseize
3 Ancestral Vision

Planeswalkers - 4
2 Liliana of the Veil
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Land - 20
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Polluted Delta
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
1 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Swamp
1 Island
1 Forest

Sideboard - 15
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Disfigure
1 Spell Pierce
1 Flusterstorm
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Null Rod
1 Golgari Charm
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Notion Thief
1 Massacre
[/deck]

I'm expecting people to try to shove Worldgorger back in Reanimator and also TPS and Sneak + Show to make a come-back.
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Post #11 by rcwraspy » Sun Jan 25, 2015 5:34 pm

Lord_Mcdonalds » Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:38 pm wrote:[Deck]
Creatures
4 Deathrite Shaman
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shardless Agent

Spells
4 Brainstorm
4 Force of Will
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Ancestral Vision
3 Hymn to Tourach
2 Thoughtseize
2 Dig Through Time

3 Liliana of the Veil

Lands
4 Underground Sea
2 Bayou
2 Tropical Island
3 Polluted Delta
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Wasteland


Sideboard
1 Null Rod
1 Creeping Tar-Pit
1 Golgari Charm
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Nihil SpellBomb
2 Disfigure
1 Umezawa's Jitte
2 Thoughtseize
1 Night of Souls' Betrayal
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Graftdigger's Cage
1 Sylvan Library
1 Vendilion Clique
[/Deck]

Back to good ol' shardless BUG

I think you're at 58 cards MD.
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Post #12 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 1:05 am

Missing two lands, Prolly +1 fetch and +1 Wasteland

#GreedIsGood

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Post #13 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 3:49 am

rcwraspy » Sun Jan 25, 2015 11:25 am wrote:So here's what I slapped together 2 days ago to create a starting point for rebuilding the deck. Obviously will need to change some things around, but I think it's a fine starting point.

[deck]
Creatures - 14
4 Deathrite Shaman
2 Baleful Strix
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Shardless Agent

Instants - 14
4 Brainstorm
4 Abrupt Decay
4 Force of Will
2 Dig Through Time

Sorceries - 8
3 Hymn To Tourach
2 Thoughtseize
3 Ancestral Vision

Planeswalkers - 4
2 Liliana of the Veil
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor

Land - 20
3 Verdant Catacombs
3 Polluted Delta
3 Misty Rainforest
3 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
1 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Swamp
1 Island
1 Forest

Sideboard - 15
2 Grafdigger's Cage
2 Nihil Spellbomb
1 Disfigure
1 Spell Pierce
1 Flusterstorm
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Null Rod
1 Golgari Charm
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Toxic Deluge
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Notion Thief
1 Massacre
[/deck]

I'm expecting people to try to shove Worldgorger back in Reanimator and also TPS and Sneak + Show to make a come-back.


think I would just play another Underground Sea over the island

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Post #14 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 3:52 am

Also no wastelands?

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Post #15 by rcwraspy » Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:18 pm

No, not on 20 lands. When I build it with 22 or cut the basics then wastes come in.
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Post #16 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:38 pm

I'd play at least 2, there are just enough strong lands in the format (grove with punishing fire, karakas, and Gaea's cradles) that warrant an answer, course in the case of cradle it may be to late but nonetheless, you can't simply let them untap with that card

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Post #17 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 4:39 pm

I'd cut the basics but I build my manabase a ultra greedy

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Post #18 by rcwraspy » Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:00 pm

at least you put in the full 22 though :-p
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Post #19 by rcwraspy » Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:02 pm

Basically this is my "lets see what happens in the format" build. Right after TC's ban I expect combo decks, which is why I'm leaning heavily on Hymns and FOWs, and I'm expecting RUG Delver to bounce back in a loud way. RUG Delver is THE Wasteland deck. Of course that doesn't mean we shouldn't run our own, but at the same time I think having basics might be important right now.
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Post #20 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:21 pm

I've always felt rug was a positive match against anyone that wasn't intimately familiar with the deck, at which point it's even, sure sometimes they get ya with wasteland, but those are hands backed up with stiffle and daze and basics aren't saving you then. I would expect more bug delver than rug, if we look at the format pre-khans and now, the only difference is no treasure cruise, Sure we have dig but that slots well into BUGs more midrange/tap out strategy, which is great because BUG delver is a remarkably good MU

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Post #21 by Mcdonalds » Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:22 pm

I wouldn't expect much combo though, a rise in bug should be anticipated and hymn + daze is one of the most miserable things to play against for any combo deck not called dredge or elves

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Post #22 by Mcdonalds » Wed Jan 28, 2015 7:12 pm

Splash siege rhino?

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Post #23 by rcwraspy » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:26 pm

is that a joke because it's all some people on this site talk about? If serious, I'd say no. You don't play any other cards at 4 CMC except the 1 SB Night of Soul's Betrayal and getting that kind of thing Dazed would feel pretty bad.
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Post #24 by Mcdonalds » Wed Jan 28, 2015 10:33 pm

It's a joke

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Post #25 by rcwraspy » Thu Jan 29, 2015 5:15 am

thank god. this deck don't need no sieging.
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Post #26 by Mcdonalds » Thu Jan 29, 2015 5:38 am

I respectfully disagree good sir

Siege Rhino is life, Siege rhino is love

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Post #27 by Mcdonalds » Thu Jan 29, 2015 5:44 am

Tempted to try 2 Disfigure in the main over 2 Thoughtseize

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Post #28 by rcwraspy » Thu Jan 29, 2015 3:10 pm

i don't hate that, depending on your expected meta. If you expect Delver to still hang around, and maybe Maverick too, then it makes sense. I'm expecting various combo decks like TPS and Sneak and Show to try to force come-backs, so I'm sticking with Thoughtseize until I'm proven wrong.
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Post #29 by Mcdonalds » Sat Jan 31, 2015 11:52 pm

3-1 at a local, unsure of digs are better than jace still, like they weren't worse than jace in any situation, just in none of those I feel jace was really better then dig

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Post #30 by rcwraspy » Sun Feb 01, 2015 3:52 pm

Jace is getting better in the meta now that Treasure Cruise and incredibly aggressive UR Delver decks are gone, but if you can't play both then I understand the appeal of Dig. Our SBs are typically silver-bullet SBs and Dig, while a one-shot instead of brainstorm every turn, is better equipped to help you find an answer immediately. It's also flexible mana-wise in a deck that taps quite a bit.
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