2012 MTGS RazziesVoting for the CI Post of 2012

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Moderators: Col. Khaddafi, iamabadman

Vote for the best CI post/thread of 2012

Arcadic's cowards and scumbags
3
30%
Sene's analysis on the leaks
0
No votes
Iggy leak on the Curse sale and the bannings
0
No votes
Madding comment on the mod lounge leaks
1
10%
Brandon/Viricide comments on WCT reforms
0
No votes
Promatim raging at Brandon/Viricide
0
No votes
WCT, casual racism and endorsement of slavery
1
10%
Azrael Gloves thread
1
10%
Harkius and state-sponsored terrorism
1
10%
Lapdog's bannings account
3
30%
 
Total votes: 10

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Col. Khaddafi
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Voting for the CI Post of 2012

Post #1 by Col. Khaddafi » Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:02 am

Here we vote for the best MTGS CI post of 2012.

Up for grabs we have one of the finest selection of an excellent yearly crop!

1. First we have Arcadic for his memerific rants about Cowards and Scumbags:

You Crazy for that one Arcadic
Originally posted by Arcadic on MTGS
It was an unverified post off of these boards. The gutter was already aware of the potential sale when N_S was banned, because he was leaked details of the sale by an unknown coward. N_S proceeded to do what he always loved to do, undermine the staff and leak the information to his gutter pals. Some other scum of the earth leaked the most recent news to them, and the bannings were once again thrown out as the gutter leaders decided that undermining the staff was way more important than the community they always say they care about.

The only reason this got leaked is because of two
staff members, one possibly former, decided that 50 users well being and communtiy was far more important to them than the community and the site they volunteered to protect and serve and maintain. Unfortunately, this is the internet, where cowards and scumbags have infinite tools to flow information and be kept secret.

You can attempt to blame the administration all you want, it is their fault and their fault alone for acting in ways that they were told was not acceptable when it happened with N_S. They all knew full well the information they had was not for them to leak, and when they over-reacted to the leak from yesterday, instead of handling it like mature adults that they claim to be, they threw tantrums.

Originally posted by Arcadic on MTGS
Why should a banned member who attacked the forum and its custodians be someone i can't speak my mind about? Someone who's friends were allowed to have inapropriate avatars in silent protest. You're effectively saying that as long as
a mod isn't speaking their mind, they are doing there job. Your forcing a divide between mod and community that isn't there and shouldn't exist.

It doesn't matter if i apologize, i will still have an infraction. It doesn't matter if other users talk about Gays being immoral. They will get the same infraction but it will still be their opinion. Saying i can't have an opinion about something that has effected me and this site isn't justifyable. I apologized to those who thought i was flaming them. I will not apologize for "flaming" people who would do anything they could to see this site burn for their own sake. If you think that's immoral, i encourage you to ask someone who's trust has be violated in the same manner to forgive them.

You want me to apologize to people who'd rather spit in my face. I won't. If you think my volunteer unpaid position requires for me to have a public opinion that is within the rules while receiving abuse and mistrust
from every angle, i suggest you put yourself in my shoes. Shoes that have had to read every single flame on the mods for months now.

But ignore that as well. Lets look at the site and its history. A history of protecting those who want to help the magic community see new cards. A group of people WOTC is probably as angry as i am over leaks. A group that i have sworn as a RM mod to protect and who's identity i won't reveal. Sources that have since the begining built MTGS from the ground up and made it the place to be for unofficial spoilers, a point that was just proven a week ago. Those people and our RM community puts the trust in the moderators to keep their secrets. Why in the world would someone trust the staff now, when it is apparent there are those who'd rather leak something for personal gain than care about the wellbeing of this website. There was once one thing you could always count on a moderator to do, and that was keep a secret. That trust was broken by 1 or 2 selfish people. So
blame me for being angry, but i have every right to be angry at broken trust. Because without it, this site doesn't exist in the capacity it does today. I may have never came here, nor would have a lot of people. If i wasn't a mod, i'd be just as angry at the people who leaked such information, because they have potentially damaged the one reason.

I am taking my infraction for speaking my mind. I don't care if i broke the COC to do so, because i could not stand idlly by any longer and let people flame the mods for the "terrible handling" of this situation. Because its not anyone's fault but the 2-3 people who are and should be banned from this site. I know i'm not above the rules. Don't pretend like i think i am. And calling this a PR stunt? Please, don't insult my inteligence any more. A PR stunt would be me rolling into this thread all apologetic and sympethtic to people I find morally bankrupt. I'd rather jump out of a moving car than pretend for a second
i feel anything but ire for those involved in the leaks.

Col. Khaddafi » Tue Sep 25, 2012 5:22 pm wrote:Guys, be careful. It is inappropriate to hang around in MTGS with Khaddafi avatars.

Stay safe guys, these are some mean streets you're walking on.

- Scumbag


2. Sene has had a solid performance in CI. Not citing his innumerous complaints about how the staff is harassed by the userbase, but we can quote here a post where he points out that staff leaks compromise transparency (likely because they uncover plots to preemptively ban members of the site) and ask people on the receiving end of "troubling leaks" to sort it out with the staff (possibly like FaheyUSMC did, prompting a thread discussing his ban). The second post accurately pinpoints all the problems of the site to just
Scumbag and a series of misunderstandings.


You Crazy for that one Sene
Originally posted by Sene on MTGS
Hi, it's me again! [url="http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=437084"]Last time[/url] I posted something like this, I was an admin expressing my concerns about a hostile community creating staff burnout, and that I was on the verge of resigning myself. I ended up resigning, as most of you probably know, for reasons not at all unrelated. Now I again feel the need to post another somewhat similar thread on the subject, though as a regular user this time around. Also, I feel I should mention that I wrote this on my own, and without the staff's input or consent. So if you dislike or disagree with what I say here, please aim your discontent at me, and not the staff.

Once upon a time, it was decided that this community should give users the power to air their grievances with things around the site, and get heard, not
silenced for their opinions. When they feel they've been treated incorrectly by moderators, they may complain publicly. This is pretty great in theory, and actually somewhat rare among internet communities - I haven't seen any forum where the users are allowed to speak their mind about this sort of stuff to the extent that they are here. But recently, things have gone too far.

One would think that when staff makes a mistake, at least the learning process will make them better equipped to make fewer mistakes in the future. I don't think that is the case on MtG Salvation. Why? Because when staff makes a mistake, they are hounded in Community Issued. They are attacked over and over, called corrupt, called liars, whatever you want. References to Subterranean Spirit and/or the exodus from MtG News are quick to surface. Now, usually when there is an outrage in CI, it is usually rooted in a legit problem. This is because staff makes mistakes, always
have and always will. It's a hard job, folks. But when they make these mistakes, try to find it in you to forgive them, or at the very least, not become outright mean. When staff is attacked relentlessly over a mistake, what's going to happen is burnout. Burnout leads to staff apathy and resignations (as we've seen plenty of during the past few months, more than any other time in the site's history, by a considerable amount), and consequently, more mistakes.

We'll all enjoy the site a lot more if we stop getting mad about insignificant issues on an internet forum. Give the people in charge the opportunity to explain their side of the story, don't go straight for the throat, and try to see things from all sides. In general, just try to be a little more friendly. It's amazing how much that helps :) (and this obviously applies to mods too)

nAlso important to remember is that while CI drama is a considerable strain on staff time and resources, most of the site doesn't know and doesn't care. Most users post about Magic: the Gathering in Magic: the Gathering forums, happily unaware of disputes and animosity, and that's how it should be. But a problem is that staff's attention is skewed towards the 3% in CI (random number), while more time should probably be spent on the rest of the site - improving the front page, improving Magic-related content in their respective subforums, etc. That's stuff that actually matters more than what's going on in this forum here, and another reason to give the staff a break.

Anyway, in the GRRRR thread we have a saying; "WWYD", which means "What Would Yomako Do". Yomako is a former mod who dispelled all kinds of grim atmospheres by just posting adorable posts with lots of :hug::aww:. I'm thinking that many CI regulars could do with a bit of WWYD these days.

Now I'll address the Mod Lounge leaker(s) directly: YOU are harming MtG Salvation in a very serious way. Yes, you are. I don't know your intentions behind these leaks, maybe you think you are doing the site a favor by letting users know things they "deserve" to know, maybe you just want to be liked by both "sides" of this mess (I hate to use the word "sides", as there shouldn't be any), but you are doing a major mistake if you, like the rest of us, would like to see MtG Salvation thrive. I don't want to accuse a single staff member of being the leak, because I consider all staff members friends, and I've had good times interacting with them in
the social areas of the mod lounge and elsewhere, but one or more of you have forsaken all honesty and integrity, and that is saddening. I'm sure that when your (the leaker's) identity is revealed, I'll be heartbroken, because I probably both liked you and trusted you. Please stop what you're doing. Thanks to you, many respected, long-time users are banned, and many good staff members have left their positions.

Those of you who are on the receiving end of these leaks: If you want the best for MtG Salvation, you should help the staff uncover the leaker(s), because these are undermining the staff and the site to a degree you might not have realized. Be an adult and don't redistribute it. Work with the staff, and if you find the information you're sent disturbing, they can probably explain what's up. Unless you hate this site and want it to die in a fire, of course, then I suppose you're doing a good job of it.
But in that case, please, can't you just leave our site alone and go somewhere else? A lot of people here love the site, even if you don't. Show some compassion.

Leaks will twist information, antagonize users, and actively prevent transparency because senior staff will now think twice about sharing anything of importance with the vanilla staff, and with good reason. The staff can't trust one another, and that is pretty much worse than anything else. I feel that the single biggest mistake I ever made as an admin of this site was (along with my co-admins at the time) bringing the information about Curse down from the Admin Lounge and into the lower staff lounges. Yes, I think my largest mistake was placing thorough trust in the staff. That is pretty messed up, and I wish it wasn't so. But at this point, I can't help but think that it is the truth.

I have talked with the admins about the possibility of a return, but as long as I feel that I can't
trust everyone on staff, I most certainly won't. Initially after I resigned, I envisioned a return before the Forum Awards to help run them, and at least in time to write the second State of the Community thread too (scheduled for December 1st, I imagine). Right now though, I can say that I have no intention of returning. For the time being, I know I just want to turtle up in my social areas, and not have to care about anything else. Least of all CI drama.

Bring the fun back! :Patriot: Also, we need more :hug:

-The Shadow Admin

Col. Khaddafi » Sun Oct 28, 2012 12:51 am wrote:
Originally posted by Sene on MTGS
Azrael,

I know the Gutter closure back in June was badly handled, and that
was really regrettable. I quite quickly turned around, and another couple with me, and then slowly more and more, until we could start actually talking about a compromise. Why didn't things work out from there? The fault lies with both, but I know that for myself, it was extremely hard to keep going. Myself and others received regular pot shots from both sides - taking the middle ground often felt like you were both sides' enemy, even though I'd fought pretty hard to stop the closure.

Clearly, the Gutterites were angry with the situation, and that was understandable. But keeping the cool was the way forward, and many did this admirably, such as Shazbot, Jobie, Ximbad, manasjap, Gaea's Regent, and many more, but far from all, and least of them N_S. I was actually really upset about what happened around mid to late July in that regard, because it was so easy to look at the minority of Gutter members who trolled and caused problems (and this took away much of the sympathy the Gutter had
received from many staff members who had "turned around" during this debacle), while the rest were actually quite easy to work with (Galspanic and myself had some lengthy private chats with many of them, and I was very hopeful that we'd reach a solution that worked). But N_S got banned, which obviously soured things, and for various reasons, things slowed down to snail's pace in pegs.

And then we got to the 2nd leak. At that point, it looked like it was all for naught, and I got so frustrated that I quit. Since then, I don't know what's been going on, but I can say that I'm very upset about what has happened since mid-June re: the Gutter. I did what I could to not get to this point, I failed, and I guess I can't say anything but sorry for that. The social space that is the Gutter obviously meant a lot to a lot of you.

That's all I can say about that. I know what N_S thinks about me, and I can only imagine what he must have told the rest of you guys at
this other forum, but believe me when I say that I've really hated all of this, and the fact that you've felt forced to move to another forum.

Lastly, I'd just like to point out that this isn't a plea to the Gutterites. It's a plea to all users here, Gutter members or not.

edit:

The staff can hardly be blamed for this, and for having been approached by Curse and had important and clearly private discussions about a potential sale of the site. The fact that the staff has had information that it was important to withhold should not be used against it.

Guys, all this "misunderstanding" was actually my fault. We can pack our bags and go home :hifive:


3. We have the leak from Iggey

Curse Sale and Banning leak
Originally posted by ExpiredRascals on MTGS
A number of our members
have been sent a PM from multiple gimmicks, a PM that reads as follows:

Iggey wrote:I think it is time to provide some updates on the MTGS sale to Curse corporation, and to provide insight on the sordid, sordid, sordid tale which led to mass bannings in this site and the closure of an entire subforum.

straight from the mod lounge wrote:Okay guys. This has been in discussion with the Globals for about a week, and a small selection of you that would be directly affected have been contacted for opinions. This is now being opened up to the rest of you.

About a week ago, the admins got in touch with our Curse liaison. This person will be directly above the admins when the deal goes through, so we're already establishing a working relationship. Fabien, our liaison, took a tour of the website with Lord Voldemort while discussing things with us. He got access to many areas, including the Speakeasy and the Gutter, and we asked him his
opinion.

The first is the biggest news. The Gutter cannot stay, even with the sanctions we've currently put in. Curse will not allow such a place on our website. The hazings, the slurs, basically many of the liberties the Gutter has, they have no place on the Curse network. Curse has told us that we have to get them in line in any way we so choose. Kill the sub or cauterize the bits that stick out of the box, they don't care. But here's the important thing: We may not say that Curse said so.

For those of you who missed the implications of that, the Staff must pull a 180 here. We must, saying it was our idea, tell the Gutter that the past four months were all for naught and that we still have to change things entirely.

I'll get to our options in a few moments.

Slightly less of a problem is the subject of the Red Zone. The Speakeasy is safe, but each of the NSFW sections will probably have to go. No real big loss in most cases. NSFWCW will probably become a censor-off sub, but no
more sexual content. NSFW Debate will probably become 'Hard Debate' or something similar so the more adult or controversial debates (the Unconscionable Position rule threads, for example) have someplace to go.

For the Gutter, there isn't much we can do.

Option 1.) Kill it. I'm saying this to get it out of the way. I would rather not do this, as it will sacrifice all credibility that the staff has. We go back on our word, and because we can't cite Curse as the reason, we're doing it for no reason.

Option 2.) As I said before, cut off anything that doesn't fit in the box. Hazing, slurs, making fun of other members, all of that? Gone. The Gutter essentially becomes an invite-only clan in its own private sub that just so happens to have its censor off. All threads except TBGTE (and maybe even that one) get moved to a private read-only subforum that can only be accessed if you have the direct link, for archival purposes.

If you guys come up with
other options, let me know. But that's about all I can come up with.

For Talore, GR, Teia, this isn't going to be fun. Sorry guys. Our hands are tied here, and I'm not going to enjoy this any more than I assume any of you will.


As it has been explained by one of the banned members in another forum:

A now banned member wrote:here's the real down low: they were going to shut us down/postpone the pegging talks because they were waiting on confirmation from Curse on whether or not we'd be allowed to stay open (re: harping on the use of hate speech). the final word came in and it not only said we couldn't use hate speech but also we couldn't stay open the way we were -- to quote "some person": Some Curse executive browsed the whole Salvation alongside rianalnn and the veredict is that the Gutter is a no go. They will only accept a censorless "clubhouse" for an "overclan" or some ****. And the fun part.
.. there is a fun part... Curse is wants to force the admins to make it look like it's their thing and not Curse's


tl;dr: kpaca and Kijin were enticed to post about the upcoming sale by the staff, which came out handy in getting them banned. Here is a post outlining the plan to ban the majority of the Gutter members:

Senori wrote:I mean, obviously a lot of Gutter people spam the forum for a while, which sucks, but you can delete those posts or ban those users pretty easily.


Iggey wrote:PS: the leak is Nai.

More to come once I get ahold of the evidence


The first quoted post was made by Nai, as an opening post to a thread specifically to find a way to not have to close the Gutter, to not have to ruin that community. The admins had talked this over for some time, trying to find a way in which we would not have to act in a manner against our ethics and honour. We had said we
weren't going to close the Gutter, and each of us wished to uphold that promise. After discussion in the Admin Lounge, discussion in the Global Lounge, we brought it to the moderators.

The various mods debated back and forth, discussing and searching for alternatives to closing the Gutter, or to neutering it. We had committed to work with the Gutter in lieu of closing it, and none of us were comfortable rescinding that promise. After increasingly frustrated discussions that could not find a good solution, the admins decided that we would rather resign than go back on our word. We decided that the best course of action was to contact Curse and ask them to reconsider their closing requirement. They informed us that we took the suggestion too seriously, that it was up to us to close or not; there had been a simple misunderstanding about the nature of our business relationship. Unfortunately, the entire discussion was blown out of proportion due to a lack of understanding about the nature of these
discussions and whether they were up for debate or not.

Unfortunately, we have had a multitude of leaks over the past two months. Some of them may have been made to better the site and simply made a mistake. Some of them may have been made to hurt Salvation. But as far as we can tell, all the poor ramifications of these leaks have come from lack of context. From non-final decisions being leaked that later changed, to details being removed from context or purposefully twisted. This is one of those leaks. The poster tries to twist the first quote to mean exactly opposite of what it means. Same with the second. Furthermore, they've taken an out of context post from another moderator in an attempt to paint them in a bad light. They are actively trying to harm our website and, while we are flattered they care that much, we must respectively decline their invitation for a pissing contest and ask them to leave us in peace. With that said, we would like to thank all those recipients of this PM who stepped
forwards to inform us that someone was attempting to harm this website. They believe in us, and they're our heroes for that. We'll see you guys around the site. :)



Originally posted by Ral Zarek on MTGS
So you guys lied about everything and banned everyone.

Cool!


4. Madding/Kaitscralt is known to have a sharp and concise style of CI posting:

Originally posted by Kaitscralt on MTGS
The staff should know by now we all have access to the mod lounge and just start deleting their posts in there as well.

Image

5. Brandon has been a true revelation when CI warriors are concerned:

Originally posted by Brandon on MTGS
I find this update --
specifically #4 -- to be disgusting, ridiculous, and utterly unsurprising. I continue to be incredibly disappointed in the work your team is doing.


6. Yet Promatim has raged and raged and raged...

Originally posted by Promatim on MTGS
What I'm reading is a regulation against racial slurs and the endorsement of slavery.

Let's have a public heart to heart, Brandon, from user to user.

I would like you to please leave MTGSalvation. Would you be amenable to that?


7. Not a single post, but all the threads about the WCT forum rules revamp with the issues around casual racism and the endorsement of slavery are totally hilarious too

8. And what about Azrael's opening of the gloves thread, which would eventually led to the removal of one of the most problematic administrators in MTGS history?

http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=432699

9. We have Harkius which comments on MTGS members supporting state-sponsored terrorrism

Originally posted by Harkius on MTGS
FYI: In displaying these pictures, you could be taken to be supporting state-sponsored terrorism.

The more you know!

Harkius


10. And last but not least we have the lapdog's take on the bannings. A true display of integrity.

lapdogs take on the bannings
Originally posted by ExpiredRascals on MTGS
Sorry guys for my somewhat abrupt absence. My internet is out until Monday, and the forums really don't like me tethering. Anyways, without further ado:

After virtually non-stop discussion, we have finished our review of this most recent incident and have reached a conclusion on what actions should be taken to fix what was a rushed set of decisions.
The following decisions are representative of a
clear majority of the opinions given during the staff discussion.

To provide context to the results of our review, our initial response to this incident was as follows:

Clock King was banned for giving use of his gimmick account to a banned member.

Kpaca was suspended for knowingly and intentionally leaked material known to be off limits, and re-posting it when it was initially deleted. This resulted in a ban due to his probationary status.

Kijin and Kaitscralt (aka Madding) were Banned for taking the same action.


After reviewing our actions during this incident, we have concluded:

Clock King

Clock King was determined to have lent one of his gimmick accounts to the banned user (N_S) for a period of roughly one month.

Despite coinciding with it, we believe his actions were independent of this incident.

Our decision is that Clock King will remain banned. His lending of his gimmick constituted a severe breach of our
ban/suspension evasion rules. Contributing to this was his full knowledge and intent in assisting ( N_S ) and his telegraphed desire to distance himself from the site.

kpaca

Kpaca posted twice about Curse in the Gutter Compromise thread. It has been determined that Kpaca likely acted in anger when an as-yet unknown person told him a rumor that the Gutter was to be closed.

We believe these responses constituted direct violations of a standing moderator request. That he proceeded to repost it immediately after he determined an admin had deleted his post makes it more clear.
We do understand that users may occasionally act in anger, but we have never allowed that to excuse them from the ramifications of their actions.

As such, we have decided to issue a suspension to kpaca for disobeying a moderator request. As he is on probation, this suspension will result in his ban from the site.

Kijin

Kijin started two threads
on the subject of Curse in the public areas of the site. In these threads he went into near exhaustive detail of all the information that was available to him.

We believe this also constituted a direct violation of a moderator request.
It was determined that it is likely Kijin, when notified of kpaca's ban, also acted in anger. It is not believed that he intended harm to come to the site or its users.

As such we have decided a suspension was appropriate for Kijin for disobeying a moderator request. Since he is also on probation, this suspension will result in his ban from the site.

Kaitscralt (aka Madding)

In much the same vein as Kijin, Kaitscralt started two threads with what we believe to be similar motive and intent. The contents of his threads were not nearly as exhaustive as Kijin's, but they did contain a significant amount of information between them. He also made two spam posts in unrelated threads in the Rumour Mill

We
believe his actions also constituted direct violations of a moderator request.

As such, we have decided to issue a suspension to Kaitscralt for disobeying a moderator request. This will be his second suspension, so it will end in 2 weeks time from the point that he was banned.

In addition the the above, a third person was also responsible for similar behavior to Kaitscralt and Kijin.

i_am_a_badman

i_am_a_badman started three threads whose content were less comprehensive than Kaitscralt's, but we believe they still contained enough information to be considered direct violations of the moderator request.

As such, we have decided to issue a suspension to i_am_a_badman for disobeying a moderator request. This will be his first suspension, so it will last for one week.

No other action or remedy was determined appropriate.
Each of the affected is free to appeal their suspension/ban on merits now. Some already have, and we are evaluating those independent
of this review. Additionally, per our ban appeal policy, those who were banned also will each have the opportunity to appeal for leniency in one year's time.
Image


Originally posted by Galspanic on MTGS
I would still like to see the posts sent over to ( N_S ) and have the Salvation Gutter archived away and replaced with a link to MTGC.
Thank you for all the lies. Another fine display of integrity by iridium :thumbsup:

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Post #2 by ( G_R ) » Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:11 pm

Caesar-like posting wins it for me. Such magnanimity!

Mcdonalds » Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:20 pm wrote:That explains why people keep coming over for chicken nuggets

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Post #3 by Second Harkius » Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:52 pm

Obv Lappy's wall of text.

Who let the dogs out?

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Post #4 by Col. Khaddafi » Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:28 pm

I went with Maddings post for his elegant, nerd rage inducing simplicity
Image


Originally posted by Galspanic on MTGS
I would still like to see the posts sent over to ( N_S ) and have the Salvation Gutter archived away and replaced with a link to MTGC.
Thank you for all the lies. Another fine display of integrity by iridium :thumbsup:

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Post #5 by Kaitscralt » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:44 am

Thanks boss
Lord_Mcdonalds » Yesterday, 3:13 pm wrote: Standard hobos who play budget garbage should be looked upon with suspicion.

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Post #6 by Kaitscralt » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:45 am

I'll credit Danny boy here
Lord_Mcdonalds » Yesterday, 3:13 pm wrote: Standard hobos who play budget garbage should be looked upon with suspicion.


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