[Fedoras of Salvation] - White Knights ITT

[zemanjaski]

You heard him talk about his penis and blowing a load, and your immediate reaction is to say "I would visit you if I could".

And we're the fags?

Does the word have some esoteric meaning I am not aware of?

[Aesnath]

Happy Birthday Z!

It might be just me, but does anyone hate modern? To me it just feels like a shitty legacy.

I guess it depends on how you feel about legacy. I know that I really dislike the format when it is "combo hell," but otherwise legacy is pretty fun. However, I come at this from a different perspective: I played vintage. Power level is relative and does not necessarily make a format more fun.

Complexity and diversity are what get me. I like being able to tinker with an idea and then try it out. What frustrates me about standard is that the metagame becomes defined and stagnant very quickly. Moreover, you are often aware of the type of solution you need, but are
aware that nothing like that exists in standard.

I think the thing that bothers most people when they are considering modern (vs. legacy) is the impressive ban list and the "4 turns" objective of it. My point is: so what. The bans mostly limit a few really stupid combos (seriously, play against hypergenesis--utterly unfun without force of will) and some choices that limit diversity. I'm not saying that I agree with all of it (nacatal in particular never made much sense), but then they may be treading lightly. Remember that legacy had a few years of existence before it had the limelight (which mostly has to do with SCG support shifting away from vintage rather than anything else).

There are a lot of very powerful cards to be messed with in modern. Aggro, midrange, control, and combo are viable (although not necessarily equally viable at this point). The format is pretty damn diverse, fairly complex, and largely open. I'm not saying modern is better than legacy, but,
so far, I've not found it to be significantly worse.

[LP, of the Fires]

Wow, a non-idiotic analysis of the modern format from a legacy head. Goodbye MTGS hello Diestoremoval. I basically agree 100% with everything you've said with the caveat that standard pre-GTC was about the best standard format in a LONG time and before Junk started to be overplayed, GTC standard was better. Not saying junk isn't top 3 if not the best deck(it is) but it's overplayed.

What's everyones favorite modern deck? Since I only play eternal formats on cockatrice and never had to worry about card costs, I'd bounce between decks all the time, but I LOVED the UR twin and Eternal Command Tempo decks. Playing fair magic for 4/5 turns then morphing into either faeries or just killing the other guy with 1000 guys is really fun. I also enjoyed kiki-pod, Kibler Domri-Naya, Storm(before it got banned), Rakdos burn, Wafo-style control, and recently various Junk midrange builds even though I classically hate Junk color decks.
Guess lingering souls is to broken to not play in all formats.

In Legacy, my best deck is ANT storm. Played TES storm for a while because the Primer on the source was WAAAAAAY to convincing telling me it was better, but ANT more fits my style. It's really just a control deck. You cantrip for infinite turns, Destroy your opponents hand, then kill them with Grave Ti-I mean tendrils. Winning through all the various hate was fun. I tried mana-less dredge but it was to limited. LED dredge is far superior in my opinion. RUG delver is a fun deck and the best brainstorm deck in Legacy which has to say something. I wanted to like Esper Stoneblade, but I think I keep playing the deck wrong. Oh well. I also play Goblins and Burn when I want to get my aggro on, though occasionly my limited knowledge of the format makes Goblins a terrible deck for me to be playing.

[Alex]

Wow, a non-idiotic analysis of the modern format from a legacy head. Goodbye MTGS hello Diestoremoval. I basically agree 100% with everything you've said with the caveat that standard pre-GTC was about the best standard format in a LONG time and before Junk started to be overplayed, GTC standard was better. Not saying junk isn't top 3 if not the best deck(it is) but it's overplayed.

What's everyones favorite modern deck? Since I only play eternal formats on cockatrice and never had to worry about card costs, I'd bounce between decks all the time, but I LOVED the UR twin and Eternal Command Tempo decks. Playing fair magic for 4/5 turns then morphing into either faeries or just killing the other guy with 1000 guys is really fun. I also enjoyed kiki-
pod, Kibler Domri-Naya, Storm(before it got banned), Rakdos burn, Wafo-style control, and recently various Junk midrange builds even though I classically hate Junk color decks. Guess lingering souls is to broken to not play in all formats.

In Legacy, my best deck is ANT storm. Played TES storm for a while because the Primer on the source was WAAAAAAY to convincing telling me it was better, but ANT more fits my style. It's really just a control deck. You cantrip for infinite turns, Destroy your opponents hand, then kill them with Grave Ti-I mean tendrils. Winning through all the various hate was fun. I tried mana-less dredge but it was to limited. LED dredge is far superior in my opinion. RUG delver is a fun deck and the best brainstorm deck in Legacy which has to say something. I wanted to like Esper Stoneblade, but I think I keep playing the deck wrong. Oh well. I also play Goblins and Burn when I want to get my aggro on, though occasionly my limited knowledge of the format makes Goblins a terrible deck
for me to be playing.

I have a pretty lengthy article about a deck I was working on pre-Bloodbraid ban that played a lot like Hippo-blade did during Scars/Innistrad Standard. I'll post it in the Modern section, despite the article having ZERO formatting and being heavily outdated. It's an interesting list that was surprisingly good for the short duration of its lifespan. I took it apart once bannings came around because I didn't "NEED" to beat Storm and Jund so specifically anymore.

As for my favorite deck currently, I've been playing UW Tron a lot. I like Gifts Ungiven and think it's a fun card.

[Dane]

LP's comment reminds me...is it possible to still get/use Cockatrice?

[Alex]

LP's comment reminds me...is it possible to still get/use Cockatrice?

Not totally sure. Most people moved over to Woogerworks, but I don't think Woogerworks offers the download for the client, nor the card files via Oracle out of fear of legal repercussions.

[Speedbump]

I find Modern to be ok, once I learned how to abuse Rakdos Charm. There is still the degenerate Combo decks in the format, but there are more fun answers to the Combo decks nowadays. I'm running RBg Burn, splashing the G to play Deathrite Shaman. Card's good.

Still trying to make myself an avatar for these forums though. Pity I'm fucking awful at Paint/Photoshop/etc.

[LP, of the Fires]

you can still play via the woogerworks server, but once the next set comes out, unless people start doing .xmls themselves, the software will fall by the wayside.

[TubeHunter]

Wow, a non-idiotic analysis of the modern format from a legacy head. Goodbye MTGS hello Diestoremoval. I basically agree 100% with everything you've said with the caveat that standard pre-GTC was about the best standard format in a LONG time and before Junk started to be overplayed, GTC standard was better. Not saying junk isn't top 3 if not the best deck(it is) but it's overplayed.

What's everyones favorite modern deck? Since I only play eternal formats on cockatrice and never had to worry about card costs, I'd bounce between decks all the time, but I LOVED the UR twin and Eternal Command Tempo decks. Playing fair magic for 4/5 turns then morphing into either faeries or just killing the other guy with 1000 guys is really fun. I also enjoyed
kiki-pod, Kibler Domri-Naya, Storm(before it got banned), Rakdos burn, Wafo-style control, and recently various Junk midrange builds even though I classically hate Junk color decks. Guess lingering souls is to broken to not play in all formats.

In Legacy, my best deck is ANT storm. Played TES storm for a while because the Primer on the source was WAAAAAAY to convincing telling me it was better, but ANT more fits my style. It's really just a control deck. You cantrip for infinite turns, Destroy your opponents hand, then kill them with Grave Ti-I mean tendrils. Winning through all the various hate was fun. I tried mana-less dredge but it was to limited. LED dredge is far superior in my opinion. RUG delver is a fun deck and the best brainstorm deck in Legacy which has to say something. I wanted to like Esper Stoneblade, but I think I keep playing the deck wrong. Oh well. I also play Goblins and Burn when I want to get my aggro on, though occasionly my limited knowledge of the format makes Goblins a terrible
deck for me to be playing.

My friend plays ANT, he recently took down an SCG with it in Kansas City. Now, my current project is Tin FIns, that deck is freaking awesome! Now, i get what you said about modern, and while I do agree it is better than standard, I already play standard a couple of times a week, so I've never really felt the need to play "Super Standard". Also, the banning practices really put me off. The only deck I truly enjoyed was a Junk deck that used Death cloud to take over the game. Neat deck.

[zemanjaski]

Tin Fins does look REALLY cool.

[Kazekirimaru]

What's everyones favorite modern deck? Since I only play eternal formats on cockatrice and never had to worry about card costs, I'd bounce between decks all the time, but I LOVED the UR twin and Eternal Command Tempo decks. Playing fair magic for 4/5 turns then morphing into either faeries or just killing the other guy with 1000 guys is really fun. I also enjoyed kiki-pod, Kibler Domri-Naya, Storm(before it got banned), Rakdos burn, Wafo-style control, and recently various Junk midrange builds even though I classically hate Junk color decks. Guess lingering souls is to broken to not play in all formats.

Splinter Twin combo and Mono-U Tron are my two personal favorites. I love em both, though I've been playing the latter lately due
to my former being stolen. Blah blah blah. Duals are expensive.

[LP, of the Fires]

FWIW I don't think modern's better then standard. Standards usually my favorite format. Well, besides block, but nobody ever plays block. In standard, there are limited resources and I think you generally have to plan better to do well. I like that.

The thing I like about modern is, post bans, there are infinite decks you can play and not feel dumb for playing. When Jund was around, it was hard to justify playing a non-jund deck. Now? Play whatever you want. The only thing I don't like about it is that sideboards are so much more important then they are in other formats. Probably why I like the decks that are hyper mana efficent and can churn through cards so quickly.

Legacy, you get to play brainstorm and price of progress. Enough said. While I think overall skill level is equal in all formats, I will say legacy matches can definitely be won or lost on VERY slim margins. On the other hand, sometimes they just don't
have the counter.

Block is amazing because it's basically if limited were a constructed format. The power level is low, so the games tend to be very interesting when you have a good block format as opposed to INN block. When the whole block is finished, I'm hoping that an orzhov deck is viable because I've been learning recently that that's some of my favorite magic to play(very grindy, but not Thragtusk>resto angel>AoS level masturbation).

[Alex]

Here's that article I was talking about.

http://community.ist.utl.pt/viewtopic.p ... 330#p48330

[Alex]

When the whole block is finished, I'm hoping that an orzhov deck is viable because I've been learning recently that that's some of my favorite magic to play(very grindy, but not Thragtusk>resto angel>AoS level masturbation).

Yeeeeeeeah, you'll really like the deck in that article, then.

[LP, of the Fires]

Squadron Hawk, Sage of Eptir, AND solemn simulacrum? Yeah, that's my kind of magic right there.

EDH, forgot to touch on this. Multiplayer edh is a joke when not played with friends. If you go to an event, someone is going to play something "unfun" people get bitchy and the experience is terrible. With friends though, the format can be very fun so long as everyones subjective views of what the "spirit of the format" or whatever bullshit is in line.

1v1 EDH is like...a legacy variant that can be very fun, though very frustrating if you're early in the brewing stages of your grixis deck because you MUST cast cruel ultimatum(I'm that guy). Still, I loved playing Superfriends control with Ruhan of th Fomori as a general.

[Alex]

[quote="LP, of the Fires » Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:04 pm"]Squadron Hawk, Sage of Eptir, AND solemn simulacrum? Yeah, that's my kind of magic right there.

EDH, forgot to touch on this. Multiplayer edh is a joke when not played with friends. If you go to an event, someone is going to play something "unfun" people get bitchy and the experience is terrible. With friends though, the format can be very fun so long as everyones subjective views of what the "spirit of the format" or whatever bullshit is in line.

1v1 EDH is like...a legacy variant that can be very fun, though very frustrating if you're early in the brewing stages of your grixis deck because you MUST cast cruel ultimatum(I'm that guy). Still, I loved playing Superfriends control with Ruhan of th Fomori as a general.[/quote:
1ysivwt8]
I'm not much of an EDH guy. That being said, I play a lot of EDH because that's what my friends around here play.

I like to build silly stuff. Rafiq of the Many superfriends, Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief combo/tron, Sygg, River Guide tron, etc. I'm thinking I'll build Maralen of the Mornsong tron instead of combo just to see how hilarious it can be.

[photodyer]

Gentlemen, I know the conversation has moved on, but I wish to revisit the rules and intent of The Ham Challenge.

Zeman--and more recently Khaos--have presented situations that create a Catch-22 relative to the challenge as an absolute ban on sexual self-stimulation. The spirit of the challenge as I perceive it is to let go of self-indulgent and arguably self-destructive obsessions with porn and solo play. As stated earlier, I accept this as a really healthy life choice, and I again thank ham for bringing the challenge to the table.

But,as our esteemed brothers have discovered through decidedly non-solo interactions with their ladies, there are times when self-pleasuring is not a solo act. Rather, it can be a healthy and incredibly erotic aspect of a relationship with a significant other without going against the principles of the challenge. Khaos's lady leaving him inspiration with the hope that he will get off
thinking about what's to come, for example, is a totally different headspace from downloading the latest from Evil Angel and grabbing a box of Kleenex.

To wit, with the indulgence of the clan and in recognition of James's birthday, I propose "The Zemanjaski Amendment". My proposal is that acts of self-pleasure directly and deliberately incited by a significant other with the intent of providing satisfaction to both parties involved on some level be exempted as a breach of the challenge. As I personally am in no position to in any way gain from said loophole at present, I can say honestly and with clear conscience that my motivations are not self-serving but directed at maintaining the spirit of healthy life choices many of us have committed to.

Obviously, final say on this resides with ham as the author of the challenge, but I respectfully submit this amendment for consideration.

[hamfactorial]

Amendment approved. I only gave Z a hard time because he's a redbro.

Though, if you have a woman sending you dirty pictures or calling you up for phone sex, do you really need to be jerking off? Maybe the challenge will spur you to give her the D instead of your Kleenex.

[zemanjaski]

I will need to ponder the usage of 'significant other'.

[windstrider]

Happy birthday, z-man!

I feel wiped. Today felt much longer than it had any right to be.

[LP, of the Fires]

Agree with the changes. Also, for photo.

[deck]
4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Gravecrawler
3 Blood Artist
4 Cartel Aristocrat
2 Skirsdag High Priest
4 Geralfs Messenger
3 Restoration Angel
2 Obzedat, Ghost Council

4 Lingering Souls
2 Orhzov Charm
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 Tragic Slip

4 Godless Shrine
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Orzhov Guildgate
2 Cavern of Souls
9 Swamp
1 Vault of the Archangel[/deck]

For more aggresion and better mana, substitute bloodthrone vampire for cartel aristocrat.

[zemanjaski]

That looks pretty playable. I do think with the combination of guildgates and caverns, you really do want Bloodthrone Vampire instead of Cartel Aristocrat though.

[Kazekirimaru]

I was going to write a Splinter Twin primer, but there already was one.

So, I wrote one for Mono-Blue Tron, instead. I've never written a primer before. o.x

http://community.ist.utl.pt/viewtopic.php?f=40&t=669

Let me know what you think, if you want.

[Lightning_Dolt]

Happy Birthday Z!

It might be just me, but does anyone hate modern? To me it just feels like a shitty legacy.

Happy Birthday Z!

I actually rather like modern, because it is like legacy without the insanely expensive cards and/or T1 kills where you sit down, lose the die roll, wait and extend the hand without playing a single card. Modern is only second to standard in my mind.

[photodyer]

I will need to ponder the usage of 'significant other'.

Alright now James...you're the lawyer, not me. I'm not trying to imply any particular level of emotional commitment, so if there is a better choice of words to apply the appropriate freedoms, I welcome the wordcrafting!

If, however, you are suggesting some introspection on your part, I will take a brotherly step back and leave you to your thoughts.

But I draw the line at clansmen using their other brothers as an excuse to fap. Redthirst, god of sexual energy that he may be, does not in my mind serve as a legal trigger for the amendment. I do not accept that RT's very presence on the
board is more than a clansmen can handle.

@ham - I agree that we should all honor the spirit of the challenge to the utmost, and I trust that our brothers will step up and make every effort to make their deposits in person where circumstances permit.

[zemanjaski]

I will need to ponder the usage of 'significant other'.

Alright now James...you're the lawyer, not me. I'm not trying to imply any particular level of emotional commitment, so if there is a better choice of words to apply the appropriate freedoms, I welcome the wordcrafting

Haha, not that.

If, however, you are suggesting some introspection on your part, I will take a brotherly step back and leave you to your thoughts.

This.

[zemanjaski]

You can all probably tell that I have not been working very hard today.

[photodyer]

Agree with the changes. Also, for photo.

[deck]
4 Diregraf Ghoul
4 Gravecrawler
3 Blood Artist
4 Cartel Aristocrat
2 Skirsdag High Priest
4 Geralfs Messenger
3 Restoration Angel
2 Obzedat, Ghost Council

4 Lingering Souls
2 Orhzov Charm
2 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
2 Tragic Slip

4 Godless Shrine
4 Isolated Chapel
4 Orzhov Guildgate
2 Cavern of Souls
9 Swamp
1 Vault of the Archangel[/deck]

For more aggresion and better mana, substitute bloodthrone vampire for cartel aristocrat.

Thanks, LK! So, bringing the token theme mainboard and bringing Artist in for ping value while still staying aggro, correct? Going Orzhov definitely smooths the mana, though I
love Evil Twin in this deck for the myriad interactions. Alternately, Essence Harvest out of the SB along with Bloodthrone as the sac source would serve to mitigate lifegain from the tusk decks along with Artist triggers.

I will be doing some playing...

[photodyer]

I will need to ponder the usage of 'significant other'.

Alright now James...you're the lawyer, not me. I'm not trying to imply any particular level of emotional commitment, so if there is a better choice of words to apply the appropriate freedoms, I welcome the wordcrafting

Haha, not that.

[
quote]If, however, you are suggesting some introspection on your part, I will take a brotherly step back and leave you to your thoughts.

This.[/quote]

That's what I thought, but I've been in legislative circles long enough to know to cover my bases! The awesome thing about the word "significant" is that it implies exactly as much or as little as one wants it to and cannot be objectively quantified by another for sake of judgement. It is one of my favorite qualifiers!

As to introspection...the fact that you already acknowledge the need to reflect demonstrates maturity and sense of responsibility. I tip my hat to you, sir.

[photodyer]

You can all probably tell that I have not been working very hard today.

I was betting on semi-turgid.










No homo.

[zemanjaski]

In every sense of the word, that will come in a few days time.

[LP, of the Fires]

That deck does a much better job of using blood artist as a spell as opposed to a creature/central engine. Additonally, you get to play lingering souls and sorin which is always a solid way of killing people when you don't have the typical aggro curve of multiple 1 drop zombies>>>Messenger.

And Obzedat. Because you need 4 point lifeswings each turn.

[Helios]

Lightning Mauler + dick + photo's extremely accurate views on why porn is a terrible thing = both the hilarity and seriousness I have come to expect. Good few pages guys.

So: I have the rather unexpected opportunity to play at FNM, having not played standard since almost the beginning of February. I have access to:

-all the checklands + shocklands
-4 Reckoners
-4 Hellriders
-2 Thundermaw
-4 Ash Zealot
-4 Stromkirk
-1 Pyreheart
-1 Stonewright
-4 Conscripts
-4 Skullcrack
-4 Spear
-4 Flames
-4 Pillar
-4 Mortars
-4 Emissary
-Most RTR/GTC commons/uncommons.

I forsee an issue getting hold of Lightning Maulers, but that would be all. My options, as I see it:

-All-in Red
-Khaos Sligh
-Higher-end RDW with Thundermaws
-Splash white for 1 Aurelia/2~3 Boros Charms
-Splash green and go Flinthoofs + Rampager.

I hate to be that guy that takes advantage of all hours ya'll put in, but I legitimately haven't
played in forever and only have 2 days to come up with a deck and get the cards together; and basically 0 time to test it.

So all that being said, what are ya'll's recommendations for playing a red deck at FNM?

I really feel like an asshole for asking for a list, but that's what I'm looking for. In return I can provide notes on games, and playtesting data. I'd like to play something solid though, so not sure if I'm sold on all-in red quite this early. Thanks for your help, and apologies again if it seems like I'm taking advantage.

I also partially flooded my bathroom while typing this. I'll leave that statement there for your interpretation.

[LP, of the Fires]

Dude, we're away from the stupid. Having said that, I don't think anyone should have to be sorry about asking for anything; other then exclusive rights to redthirst. We have to share.

If you can get a hold of legion loyalists and lightning maulers, I'd ask you to be a dear and test out the deck that Z's discussing which we're tentatively calling All-in-MonoRed. Otherwise, I'd suggest going with either Khaos Sligh, or 20 land Gruul which is basically mono-red with 4 Boar and 2/3 Rampager.

The bigger red decks are likely ill positioned due to Junk Reanimator necessitating a short clock. Zealous conscripts IS a really good card though...

[Helios]

LP: Thanks Having gone through the All-In thread and read some of the logic, it does look hilariously fun. If I can put it together, I might just run with that.

See, my issue isn't how to play the deck, it's mostly that I don't know what the right call for this meta is. In a vacuum, there's definitely a part of me that wants a curve of Hellrider->Thundermaw->Aurelia (as a 2-of, maybe even 1), 24 lands, and a handful of Boros Charms. But I legit just have no concept of what the format looks like since the rise of Junk reanimator; is Thundermaw even good? Etc.

If ya'll can settle on a list you want me to take to FNM, I'll take All-in Good night gents!

[zemanjaski]

I should develop my competitive decks like Travis Woo does

[hamfactorial]

You already developed a Travis Woo deck.

[photodyer]

I should develop my competitive decks like Travis Woo does

You mean by taking the working ideas of players who choose to publicly share, calling them your own and failing to give credit? Sounds too "American opportunist" for you, Zeman.

[Sioux]

Happy Birthday, Z.

Man, we had a kitchen table tournament tonight and it was crazy. We had a huge oddly held kitchen table tournament with $6.00 on the line as the final prize. Needless to say Boros Reckoner and Thundermaw Hellkite helped me to win the tournament in the end and the $6.00.

Although the most critical moment of the night was in the semi-final three way winners round with my R/w Boros Sligh against an already life depleted Werewolf deck and a nearly dead Orzhov player. The Orzhov player threw everything but the kitchen sink at us and our combined aggro, plus a small bit of inspired play by me utilizing a Boros Charm bouncing five damage against him, beat him down to 4. The Werewolf guy was down to 2 due to some extreme extortion and my Cackler/Ash Zealot damage and I had 13 life from the extortion and a couple turns of 1000 Lashes damage. In the final part of the semi-finals I had a Boros Reckoner, the Orzhov
guy a Treasury Thrull, and the Werewolf player was rocking a Bane of Hanweir. In the end I blocked the Treasury Thrull, bounced the damage at the Orzhov guy killing him and knocking him out of the tournmanet and just when I was about to scoop following my Reckoner's demise I ended up topdecking a pillar of flame and won the semi-finals.

The finals was bad draws and mulligans for the Werewolf guy and some of the best I've ever drawn with the Boros Sligh which murdered him with Stromkirk Noble, Cacklers, Thunder Maw, and Hell Rider.

Man, Boros Reckoner is an amazing card.

[Khaospawn]

[quote="[url=viewtopic.php?p=48308#p48308:12sc2vj6]LP, of the Fires » Wed Apr 03, 2013 10:03 pm[/url:12sc2vj6]":12sc2vj6][quote="[url=viewtopic.php?p=48294#p48294:12sc2vj6]Khaospawn » Wed Apr 03, 2013 5:30 pm[/url:12sc2vj6]":12sc2vj6]
My hand is like a Lightning Mauler bonded to my penis! Help! [/quote:12sc2vj6]

I wish you weren't all the way across the country mate, or I would visit you. That was the best thing I've heard all week. That and Alex's comment about potentially streaming with Z and myself. I just imagined shit that would happen and teared up.

You guys are the best.

Most of all redthirst.

Fags.[/quote:12sc2vj6]

I'm glad I could use Lightning Mauler in a way that didn't involve attacking
with it.

Seriously though, if I could only win the lottery I'd build a large compound where we could all live, complete with a moat filled with mutated 8-limbed crocodiles, a brewery, and a gay brothel (for redthirst). Buses filled with women would come in and out every other day and there would be statues sculpted in our likenesses to be placed at the entrance for outsiders to worship.

Oh yes, the FoS Compound could happen. I'm just saiyan.....

@Helios - Z's all-in Red looks like a blast to play (literally and figuratively). I think you should give it a go.

RE: Ham Challenge Amendment - Best idea ever!

RE: Fave Modern deck - I know it's a dead deck now, but Epic Ascension (U/R Storm) was a freakin' blast to play. But in the meantime, I play R/b Burn and Boros Landfall and they're pretty fun as well.

RE: Aesnath's awesome Modern analysis - Agreed!