[Fedoras of Salvation] - White Knights ITT

[zemanjaski]

And Zem did drop many names, and nobody was impressed, and his station was regarded as a pedestal of cardboard unable to sustain the great marsupial's ego

Did I mention that I get to chat with Patrick Sullivan regularly? Pretty sweet.

[Kaitscralt]

so sayeth the deer god

[Kaitscralt]

Patrick Sullivan is pretty awesome

[zemanjaski]

I still am to those with whom I have a good relationship.

So you became a huge dick to certain people because you "quit having a good relationship" with them, but why did that happen?

I think...

---

...it happened because you were a huge dick to them.

It probably doesn't help that you consider anyone not taking
everything you say to be the Gospel or people trying to help you to be, you know, less of a dick as a personal insult.

But you know, whatever, why change when what we got here seems to be working too...

Take a moment to list who I don't have a good relationship with.

[redthirst]

I don't claim to perfect. I won't even pretend that I care.

You don't have to pretend. You obviously do care. What you should stop doing is pretending that you don't care.

[zemanjaski]

so sayeth the deer god

DEER GOD

[redthirst]

Take a moment to list who I don't have a good relationship with.

Me and Suga, obviously, but you don't seem to be getting along with Dechs at the moment, either, and you have a tendancy to snipe at others who question you in any way - though most tend to simply back down instead of escalating the situation.

The thing is, I don't know of anyone else in the Clan that has an issue with Suga, Dechs, or me - I guess they could be there without me knowing, though.

[zemanjaski]

I have no ongoing issue with Dechs; we just misunderstood each other today and I appreciate his sense of humour.

I have my reasons for disliking you and for detesting Suga, but its not appropriate to go into them here.

So, 2/50+? I can live with that.

[redthirst]

I have no ongoing issue with Dechs; we just misunderstood each other today and I appreciate his sense of humour.

I have my reasons for disliking you and for detesting Suga, but its not appropriate to go into them here.

So, 2/50+? I can live with that.

Well then, if you're happy with the current arrangement then I guess I am too.

See you space cowboy.

[zemanjaski]

Sure. You can do better than sniping at me though. If you're the leader, act like it and I will follow.

[redthirst]

Sure. You can do better than sniping at me though. If you're the leader, act like it and I will follow.

I call you out when you're being petty and arrogant because I prefer zeman to madding 2.0. From what I can tell, Suga is doing the same thing and I can imagine Dechs may have be trying that as well.

Sadly, it has so far not had the desired effect.

[DarthStabber]

In every group there's always problems between "the leader" and "the lancer", and if we apply literary analysis to clan dynamics I think this is what we see at play. There are obviously other reasons that bely these issues, but narratively they make little difference. So now who's "the big guy", who's "the brains", and who's "the chick"?

[redthirst]

You can be the chick.

[DarthStabber]

Works for me, I'll get my skirt.

[zemanjaski]

Pretty fair DS.

Look, my principal gripe is what Suga said about Pip and that you thought it was funny and encouraged him; after that I haven't bothered to show any consideration or concern, why should I.

[redthirst]

Umm... because it's absolutely stupid to throw away a solid year + because of one joke that wasn't even that bad?

Honestly, I think your scale for measuring these things is way different from everyone else's.

[zemanjaski]

Unfortunately, that's why we're not going to see eye to eye in the future. I'll forgive most things without a second thought, but you're asking an awful lot, while not even acknowledging how over the line the comment and your behaviour was. If you truly think you did nothing wrong then there really isn't any point in us discussing it further - we won't be showing each other any respect in any such discussion.

[zemanjaski]

And don't pretend that he was joking, he said it to hurt me and to illicit a response.

[redthirst]

And if you consider that some sort of unforgivable sin then, yeah, we're not going to get anywhere. Just keep in mind that the whole council has discussed this topic at your request and no one else thought it was a big deal or warranted any kind of action either.

So while you may think that was some sort of egregious offense, no one else does... so just maybe I'm not the one who's asking an awful lot here.

[Kaitscralt]

what was the joke

[redthirst]

zem said he blocked Suga so Suga said you did something to someone from the back to see if it were true.

I said "Whatwhat?"

[Kaitscralt]

um

[zemanjaski]

You have a very selective interpretation of what others say.

And of what is acceptable.

But i'm not surprised given your views on other things.

[zemanjaski]

I am sure you would be willing and fine with making jokes about people's children then.

[zemanjaski]

This is the line you want to draw in the sand.

[redthirst]

I am sure you would be willing and fine with making jokes about people's children then.

I think kait said my kid had a big head...

Besides, I guess it would depend on the joke. I don't see much wrong with saying two consenting adults did something when you everyone knows it's not true. It's significantly nicer than a lot of the stuff some people said to Kaze...

[zemanjaski]

You keep saying it was a joke when you know he said it to hurt me. You'll even go so far as to misrepresent what other council members have said. Some leader.

[redthirst]

This is the line you want to draw in the sand.

And don't act like that's the line. The line is whatever you arbitrarily decide is offensive. For example:

Making fun of the Polish - not crossing the line
Making fun of the French - CROSSING THE LINE!
Making fun of some guy's wife cheating on him in real life - not crossing the line
Saying your gf cheated on you when it's not true - CROSSING THE LINE!

[zemanjaski]

They said it wasn't worth exiling him, not that it wasn't a problem. The only person to definitively say they had no issue with it was you. Funny that.

[Khaospawn]

so sayeth the deer god

DEER GOD

Zemmy Deerest

[Purp]

Ok, you guys can stop now.

[redthirst]

You keep saying it was a joke when you know he said it to hurt me. You'll even go so far as to misrepresent what other council members have said. Some leader.

Are you seriously under the impression that Suga believed that saying someone thousands of miles away had sex with your gf - which everyone knows isn't true - was attempting to hurt you?

And misrepresented how? I'm pretty sure we were all on the same page. +EDIT+ Ah... sorry, didn't see the new post - we all agreed it was no big deal - really. I believe I can sum up the feeling as being "that shouldn't have been said, but the whole thing was blown way out of proportion."

[zemanjaski]

This is the line you want to draw in the sand.

Making fun of the Polish - not crossing the line

If Yarpus didn't already make fun of Poles himself and was annoyed, you can bet I would have his back. There's also a difference between light hearted commentary that highlights the difference between cultures and your desperate need to affirm your perceived American superiority.

Making fun of some guy's wife cheating on him in real life - not crossing the line

Yeah, I sure make fun of Kaze for that all the time... why don't you
ask Kaze about our friendship instead of trying to speak for him?

[Khaospawn]

Man, I should've known something was wrong with me when I all I wanted to do was sleep on my day off yesterday. Now I've got some fucking cold that feels like it was created by the Umbrella Corporation. I'm expecting to mutate any minute. Is this what I get for staying out late Monday night crushing my enemies with Modern Burn?

[zemanjaski]

Some council members took a position of non-engagement, at least two others said that Suga's conduct was not acceptable. There was a range of opinions within the group - that's why we have a council.

[zemanjaski]

You keep saying it was a joke when you know he said it to hurt me. You'll even go so far as to misrepresent what other council members have said. Some leader.

Are you seriously under the impression that Suga believed that saying someone thousands of miles away had sex with your gf - which everyone knows isn't true - was attempting to hurt you?

I believe he is like that yes.

[zemanjaski]

If all Suga wanted was a response, he could have tested me with anything else. There was no need for it to be that personal if he wanted to see if I would see his comments (which he already knew I would, given we were in a game of mafia at the time).

[zemanjaski]

I am immensely amused that the FoS leadership is seriously referred to as "the council" and that removing someone from the clan is called "exiling."

We have fancy names for everything.

[Khaospawn]

Red and Z, I recommend that you guys take the discussion elsewhere, like PM or some Private thread. This is the clubhouse, not a place where we air our dirty laundry. I'm not trying to further escalate things by saying this. I love both you guys and I don't want to pick sides here. I just really think that this conversation shouldn't be occurring in this particular thread.

[redthirst]

Yeah, I sure make fun of Kaze for that all the time... why don't you ask Kaze about our friendship instead of trying to speak for him?

I'm not saying you made fun of Kaze, and I'm not speaking to your relationship, but I don't remember you making a shit fit about the people that did or deciding that their actions were unforgivable either.

You keep saying it was a joke when you know he said it to hurt me. You'll even go so far as to misrepresent what other council members have said. Some leader.

Are you seriously under the impression that Suga believed that saying someone thousands of miles away had sex with your gf - which everyone knows isn't true - was attempting to hurt you?

I believe he is like that yes.

Wow. Well, okay.