Dies to Removal

@MDU - although I'm playing Burn I like to keep up with the latest version of the deck and after asking you about LBZ in the main I put together exactly the same 75 as you just posted!

[deck]Almost MDU Rakdos Aggro[/deck]

Took this to FNM last night. Main tournament was modern but we managed to set up an 8-man standard tournament. I went 2-1, lost round one to G/u Devo Turn 4 Garruk both games (man that deck can be explosive). Then beat a Golgari midrange brew, new player with a terrible deck. Beat mono-U in the third game.

Some thoughts: I'm definitely getting the 3rd dragon, that card just wins games.
Vexing Phoenix was good, very good actually, only time i wasnt happy to see it was when my G/u opponent was low on health and i knew he had just drawn an arbor colossus (from garruk), any haste creature would have gotten him im burn range All other times it just beat face, many decks can't handle the 5/5 flyer.
Ash Zealot was good, but i always wished she was Jester (why oh why can't i just play 7 of that), so think I'm sticking with her for now.
Exava is tha boss, but you all knew that

All in all i was very happy with the deck, it has so much power and control other decks have a very hard time keeping up

lost round one to G/u Devo Turn 4 Garruk both games (man that deck can be explosive).

The RG / GU devotion builds are just crazy if they can "go off" --- their ability to vomit their hand out on the table and then +1 Garruk to refill their hand is just sickeningly good and difficult to beat.

Alright, time for fnm write-up.
Decklist I had was:
[deck]Rakdos Aggro[/deck]


Match 1 was vs Mono-u Devotion. Needless to say that I wasn't super excited to see it.
-Game 1 I raced him out of the gate, and he had a slow start while I had jester, removal, and an exava.
SB: -4 Cackler, -4 Jester, -1 Exava, +3 LBZ, +3 Doomblade, +2 Mortars, +1 Whip. All of it was fairly straight-foreward besides the exava, and I took her out because it's what MDU did, and I decided to
defer. It's a good card here, but not the best, and the fliers are better.
-Game 2 He got a great start, and I spent the early game removing stuff. Eventually I got a fw phoenix online, but he domesticated it, and when I tried to kill it, counter it. So we had a topdeck war and I couldn't find removal, so I died to my own phoenix.
-Game 3 he did a little damage, but I just blew up all his stuff and beat him down with fliers.
1-0 (2-1)

Match 2 was vs mono-red blitz/devotion. It was an odd budget build, but it actually got into the top8 of the atlanta open
-Game 1, he got a quick start and while I was able to minimize damage some and keep up, it ended in a top deck war, where I found land only for 3/4 turns.
SB: -4 Cackler, -4 Jester, +3 Doomblade, +2 LBZ, +1 Whip, +2 Mortars. I didn't swap an exava for the third zombie, since I knew he didn't run reckoner or really anything white/green (bte only, and that was already played by the time lbz comes out)
-Game 2 I burned out his stuff and landed a
turn 4 whip. After that I just threw down an exava and began beating on him and gaining too much life for him to handle. He kinda went stupid and didn't try to block, and just kept swinging. But, considering it'd be tough to block exava anyway…
-Game 3 Went almost the exact same as the first, but when we entered topdeck, I had a dragon out. Then he topdecked a mortar followed by a fanatic, while I got land for another 3 turns.
1-1 (1-2)

Match 3 was vs Rakdos Aggro. Slightly different from ours, ran herald instead of phoenix, etc, etc.
-Game 1 my hand was pretty aggressive, so I raced. I got out a jester and beat him while burning his threats. Then I eventually landed an exava which he killed, then a dragon. It was just too much for him.
SB: -4 Cackler, -2 Jester, +3 Dark Betrayal, +2 Mizzium Mortars, +1 Whip. He was also running black, so not much point in lbz.
-Game 2 I just burned his stuff out and then beat him down. Textbook game.
2-1 (2-0)

Match 4 was vs Mono-black devotion. Stock list,
not much special, though I did see he was running ultimate price.
-Game 1 I kept a hand full of removal, and hoped to scry into some threats. Didn't for too long.
SB: -2 FWPhoenix, -2 Shock, -2 Magma Jet, +3 Dark Betrayal, +3 Skullcrack.
-Game 2 I had an interesting opening hand. He mulliganed, and I kept it, but then thought that I maybe shouldn't have. Tell me what you think: "2x swamp, 1x guildgate, 1x exava, 1x dragon, 1x strike, 1x jet"
Anyway, game went like I hoped, I drew the land I needed, jet'd him to grab more pressure(2nd exava), he tapped out turn 3 for a connections, exava landed and hit him. He killed it, I hit him with the second. So on and so forth. It was just too much pressure.
-Game 3 I finally saw some of my early game stuff, and a turn 2 jester began beating on him. Exava and dragon followed. It was just too much.
3-1 (2-1)

Match 5 was vs a boros aggro-(sorta)burn list.
-Game 1 was okay at first, but he kept drawing lands after his opener, and those few creatures
weren't enough to stop me.
SB: -4 Cackler, -4 Jester, -1 Exava, +3 Doom Blade, +2 Mortars, +1 Whip, +3 Lifebane Zombie.
-Game 2 he got stuck on only 2 white lands after a risky opening hand, and it took him a few turns to find some red with a cipt land. During that time I killed whatever he could play, and then dropped an exava followed by a dragon. When he admitted defeat, I still had a hand of 1Strike, 1Whip, 3Downfall, 1 Exava.
4-1 (2-0)

We played a game 3 for fun afterwords, where we both got flooded, and it ended with him at 5 with 2 c's phoenixes and a ground creature, and me with a 5/5 fwphoenix. He attacked with one of the phoenixes, and so I had to topdeck a removal. I did.



Overall was really happy with the deck, though I kept playing aggro. The cackler's were removed most every game, and even vs mbc they weren't super amazing, though they did help. Going ash zealot isn't a bad idea.
I was very happy with the Flame-Wreathed Phoenix, as it just provided a lot of power. I even got
to live the dream once and play it with exava out, and got to swing in with a 5/5 haster

Good list RaidaTheBlade, I'll swap a SBD and Whip MD/SB though.

IDK how I feel abut LBZ vs Red, I think I'll prefer running Jesters for trades.

Yeah, I agree on the lbz. The next match, I didn't bring him in.

And was the nice list to this one or the one from yesterday?
I honestly would not drop the third stormbreath. Having that heavy-hitting topend is so important. I would much rather drop a piece of low-impact removal if you want a whip main.

SBD is good because its Pro White and it Flies, outside the control MU being Pro white means nothing so his value is just on the fact that it flies.

Vexing Phoenix also happens to fly thus in all MUs beside control, he acts like mini-SBD, sure you can choose to run 3x SBD with the rest but your really asking for some horrible hands... (if I was running LBZ main I'll have 3-4 SBD 100%).

[deck]Rakdos Seer v. 2[/deck]

Taking this to the saturday tourney in my local game shop, stoked!

Went 3-2 today, turns out over half my meta is now mono red aggro

yikes

Really sad and angry atm. I can't see myself playing it again...

I play in a meta with an alarmingly high number of people on RG monsters, or trying to making Selesyna or Golgari aggro work, so I maindeck LBZ. I love it. Even if it whiffs, it's still a 3 power (normally) unblockable beater that lets me get free information on their hand. I don't think I'd want to drop it even if the meta changed.

I haven't gotten to play this deck as much as I'd like, but I'm kicking off a week of binge magic starting today. I'll be taking a slightly older version of MDU's Rakdos Aggro to an IQ later today. I'll write up a small report for you after.

I'm feeling pretty good about my sideboard decisions, but I haven't playing vs UW/x control at all.

How strongly do you value Dreadbore and HDF vs them? I'd theoretically like to bring in Skullcrack, LBZ, and possibly Mizzium Morters against them, but the option seems to be between cutting the terror effects or cutting most of the burn.

I feel like this is a match where you kind of have to guess about if they are bringing in creatures like Archangel of Thune and Brimaz and hope to hedge vs the creatures even at the expense of some of your burn.

I'd only ever bring the mortars in vs a uwx control deck if they were esper, since only blood baron doesn't die to dreadbore or downfall. Even then, dragons, fwphoenix, or double burn kills/trades with him, so you've gotta wonder if it's worth it.

What I bring in is 3 lbz, 3 skullcrack, dropping 2 jet, 2 shock, 2 dreadbore. Flame wreathed phoenix can be dropped too, but I like having as many creatures as possible.

If it's esper, then i'd probably sideboard the same, and just hold burn and hd back some for bbov and ghost dad.

I am gonna write a report of the PTQ later, maybe tommorrow. I tilted heavily at 3-1 and lost a game that should have been mine easily. Went 5-3, of which one loss was the first round, then the fifth (tilting) and finally seventh round (bad keep, bad SBing). Ended 36th out of 169 people which is not bad but certainly not to my abilities or expectations - the experience is welcome though and I know what I have to work on.

TOP 8 was 4x Bx devo, 1x RG Monsters, 1x UW Control, 1x Uw Devo and 1x Rw Burn. The PTQ was won by a polish guy (Szuler on MTGO) playing Burn - really close to what the guys at the Burn thread currently have.

Just two things now: B/W matchup I don't think we can win SBing out our burn. Met it in the R7 and R8 and sided out all Dragons in R8 instead of burn - the games were much favorable then. Also I met no Bx devo, only 1 Ux devo and no GR Monsters (the loss in the first round must have sent me into
battling homebrews), albeit the meta looked like that:

that really sucks we built the brew to combat T1 list so facing home-brews/causal isn't what we want. That said 36 is an impressive position

In regards to BW, which version? Gary with White splash (just treat this like Bx Devotion), BW Midrange (treat it like Grx Monster) or BW Control (they have more hand disruption then removal so boarding out burn would be correct here unless they're NOT running DD (you can find this info out if you don't see specter or DD in GG assuming you didn't win in 4-5 turns).

- - - - - - - - - --

I still havn't picked up my standard cards since the start of MOCS4.... so I'm about 2 weeks behind you guys in terms of experience here are some old videos:

[deck=MDU's Young Radkos]Lands 23
n6 Mountain
6 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Temple Of Malice
2 Rakdos Guildgate
1 Mutavault

Creatures 21
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Young Pyromancer
2 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
2 Lifebane Zombie
2 Stormbreath Dragon

Spells 16
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
3 Shock
3 Dreadbore
2 Hero's Downfall

Sideboard 15
1 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
2 Lifebane Zombie
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Doom Blade
4 Skullcrack[/deck]

Standard Elimination Report (Event 6812218)
Standard Elimination R1 Young Rakdos vs Esper Control Event 6812218
Standard Elimination R2 Young Rakdos vs Esper Aggro Event 6812218
Standard Elimination R3 Split

Either the midrange or control lists. Essentially BBoV, Pack Rat, DD main with hand disruption like you said and Obzedat side. Haven't met one without DD yet.

The problem with siding out almost all our burn is that it makes Phoenix really weak. If we do keep only LS in we can recur Phoenixes only once or twice, if ever, since we may need to strike to finish a baddie. SBD on the other hand is (especially after sideboarding) usually a dead card since all of their removal (Elspeth including) short of Bile Blight takes care of it. Pro white is nearly useless since blocking Baron won't happen often and getting through a blocking Obzedat isn't a likely scenario either.

in the second match facing it I took out 2 Shocks, 3 Dragons, 2 lands and put in 2 LBZ, 2 Mortars and 3 Dark Betrayals. For the third game there I decided to take out the Whip and insert the one Devour Flesh (although next time I am gonna keep the Whip and
instead take out smthing else). This still keeps us threat heavy and does not diminish our ability to recur Phoenixes, which is one of our strongest cards against removal heavy decks.

I can't argue with that logic because I agree Chandra's Phoenix is critical in winning the Bx MU. Though we make every DB they run really hurt....

Ok, I'll try boarding out the SBD (its what I use to do when I was playing Pyrodragons) without the dragons it also means you can got down 1 land or 2 lands since (23) is good enough for 3x 4cc creatures - this should provide more then enough room for SBs.

I top 8ed the IQ in played in today, but didn't make it out of top 8. It was surprisingly small, last time I went to an IQ at the same store it must of had 70 players, but we had about 30 today.

It was only 5 rounds with a cut to top 8, which is feel like a regular FNM to me. Went 3-1-1 in swiss. My loss in swiss and in top 8 were both to B/w decks that player BBoV, DD, and Pack Rat. I understand it can be a hard match up, but I had some pretty bad beats stories vs them today.

In the 3rd game of my swiss match vs B/w, I gas him and even kill a Obzedat that he didn't blink so he could block with a Mizzium Mortars. My opponent who is now playing off the top rips DD, Pack Rat, and Boom Blade consecutively while I find land, land land, while already having 6 land in play. In game one of top 8, I play haste creatures and he kills all 4 of them immediately, then drops a turn 5 DD, turn 6 DD, and turn 7 BBoV.

Now, when
you lose you can't just say "they got lucky". You have to consider everything that you're doing and think about sideboard decisions and card choices. I had some good value from FWP in the tournament, I even had 2 games where opponent's mistakenly paid the tribute when I had Exava out. One issue is that those usurp the place of LBZ, which would probably help me out vs B/w, but then another thing to remember is that B/w may be the victim of a shifting meta. 2 weeks ago we saw a big win for Mono B Devotion at an SCG standard open and it beat B/w decks in both the semi and quarter finals. Mono B decks dropped NVS to play LBZ main, which can swing that match up from unfavorable to favorable it seems, so I wonder how much I should really be concerned with beating BBoV decks right now when the metagame may shift to them being 2nd class decks, not even beating the deck they are supposed to beat.

I'll think about writing up a fleshed out report later.

On another note; a TCG player 5K was won by
this deck:
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1189540

Is this the deck we want to be playing?

So, kinda just wanna do a bit of housekeeping. It seems like we've pretty much got the core of the deck settled.
(Please forgive the formatting, deck tags don't like some things)

[deck]Rakdos Aggro Core[/deck]


The changes between decklists now seem to be focused on a few questions:
1) "Do we want 1-drops?"
2) "Do we want shocks?"
3) "Flame-Wreathed Phoenix or Lifebane Zombie main?"
4) "Do we want a whip, and if so, main or side?&
quot;


I'd like to get people's answers on where they fall on each question and why. Also current decklists if you want to. I think we're getting really close to where the ideal place is.

The changes between decklists now seem to be focused on a few questions:
1) "Do we want 1-drops?"
2) "Do we want shocks?"
3) "Flame-Wreathed Phoenix or Lifebane Zombie main?"
4) "Do we want a whip, and if so, main or side?"


I'd like to get people's answers on where they fall on each question and why. Also current decklists if you want to. I think we're getting really close to where the ideal place is.

My answers to your questions:

1) I think this is very meta dependent. In the testing I've done I really like the 1-drops when I'm the beatdown, cackler into jester for 5 dmg on turn 2 is just super strong. That said I feel
like I end up as the control just a little too often in my LGS to warrent running 1-drops, hence i run Ashley because she is amazing on defense AND offence.

2) Well i run Ashley... (So that's a very big yes). I think most people want them though, the deck i kinda soft to aggro and they help stem the bleeding.

3) I doubted the Phoenix from the beginning, but after running it last Friday I must say that I am a believer. Card is almost always just super strong. Zombies are amazing as well and the 3 in my SB aren't going anywhere, but i feel like SB is where they belong.

4) I haven't tested the whip, you guys came up with that plan too late for me to have time to get one (Meaning i was too stupid to figure it out for myself ). Anyways, it seems super
sweet in many match ups and i want to test it main when i can get my hands on one.

So you've been running ashley? Have you had any problems casting her/any mana weirdness at all?

Basically, I like the idea of 3x some 2-drop besides jester, and I wanna look at the options.

Ashley is the forerunner at the moment, but some other things to consider are pack rat, spiteful returned, young pyromancer, rix maadi guildmage, tymaret, and shred-freak.


They can kinda be broken up into 3 categories: aggressive, utility/manasink, and packrat.

Aggressive:
Ash Zealot - What a beautiful young lady. One of the best red 2-drops ever. Only drawback is that the casting cost might be awkward on occasion. Is also useful when playing as the control, because of firststrike.
Shred-Freak - Lets face it, only reason to run him is if ash zealot's cost turns out to be too much
Spiteful Returned - Kinda cute, but an automatic 2 damage on swing is pretty fancy. Might not get played as a 2-drop too much. Again, is cute,
but maybe not actually effective enough.

Utility/Manasink: (kinda 2 smushed together, cause they are similar)
Young Pyromancer - YP$ makes all of our removal even better. Suffers a lot in a world of drown in sorrow, bile blight, supreme verdict, and anger of the gods.
Rix Maadi Guildmage - Hasn't seen much use recently, but it a pretty good manasink. Drops the opponent by an extra life, or enables nicer trading (specially with exava)
Tymaret - An interesting creature that can be difficult to remove, but he's legendary, and requires feeding creatures. Was okay with young pyromancer, but without he can push through a tiny bit of extra damage, but isn't too impressive.

Packrat:
Pack Rat - What a surprise. One of the format's breakout stars from before bng, and one that I used in a deck almost exactly like what we've got now to a lot of success. We don't have the underworld connections to feed him like b/x does, but he can still just steal games all on his own. Bile Blight and all the sweepers
weaken it, but it's still strong.


So far ashley or pack rat get my attention for inclusion as a 3-of in the deck. Both have proven themselves in the past, but are good vs different things. Ashley is better vs u/w/x control, and b/x control/devotion. Pack rat folds to both of those, but can get free wins vs midrange and other non-sweeper decks.
Both are pretty good vs aggressive decks, though each has different issues vs u/x devotion. I'd give zealot the edge there though because of u/w being the main form of u devo nowadays, and detention sphere shuts packrat down HARD.


So yeah, I get talky and thinky at night

Are we an Aggro deck? or a Midrange deck (people complain about the strangest things on Sally)?

I'd still say aggro (though I think you once called it aggro-control, which I like).
It is kinda riding the line though.

The idea and the execution behind it are that of an aggro deck, that can offer a lot of fast hard-hitting pressure, and still have the reach to go long. So in that respect, it kinda fills a niche in between the two, racing under midrange/control, while being bigger then aggro.


Don't know if it really matters what we call it though, as long as we make sure that it keeps doing what it does as well as we can. 'Cause I really like the deck. It's really close to the deck I took to that win in december. It plays in a way I just enjoy

I really don't know if we are aggro or midrange, some games i play nothing but removal for 3/4 turns and then slam some big threat (Big phoenix, Exava or dragon) and beat my opponent to death with that. This seems very midrange, but other games i go Jester, into small phoenix into Jester + ashley which i would certainly call aggro. I think the strength of the deck is that we can do both things very well.

Any list that can do T4 kills should probably be called an aggro deck i guess

Nice to see people posting in this thread again, here's the list I've been messing with;
I like what other people have being doing with the archetype, and Lifebane Zombie seems like the stones right now. I'd definitely be maining those, but I wanted to have black as a splash. Part of this reason is wanting to run 4 Mutavault and [
card]Ash Zealot[/card]. I've gone about this by having max Rakdos Guildgates. With so many CIPT lands, 1-drops lost a lot of luster. Other than that though, the mana has been great and 4 'vaults is a big game.

I feel silly playing less than 4 Stormbreath Dragons, so the full set is in. I like Shock in this list because of Ash Zealot and [card]Chandra's Phoenix[/card]. I've got 13 ways of recurring Phoenix, which seems decent enough. This list loses some Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch and Flame-Wreathed Phoenix firepower, but you can't have it all.

I haven't nailed down the sideboard yet, but I guess I'm on burn vs. control and terrors vs. midrange, as is typical for this archetype.

Ya'll see this list that won the 5k this past weekend?

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1189540

Sweet list, not too keen on playing the rat though, but maybe it's worth it. At least that guy seemed to be doing alright for himself.

Ya'll see this list that won the 5k this past weekend?

http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=1189540

Its a slightly updated take on the original list with pedros cooked up, its a solid list well suited in dealing with Gx

Here is my write up for the IQ I played in yesterday.

I'm feeling a bit lazy and the decklist should be uploaded to the SCG website soon, so I'll just link in the decklist later.

Round 1 vs Burn.

I remember some concerns from MDU and others about the burn match up being hard. I started game 1 out with Spike Jester and then a Chandra's Phoenix, but I lost to a flurry of burn spells. 2 Warleader's Helix and 2 Boros Charm sealed my fate. I dropped all the terrors from the deck and sided in 4 skullcrack and 1 LBZ. Game 2 was a slow start from me, with only a spike Jester being my early play. He sat there with lots of cards in hand while I played a FWP and then a SBD to win game 2. In game 3, I again got a early Spike Jester, which he burned out. Then a Chandra's Phoenix which I used to chip him down from 14 to 6, the pair of Lightning Strikes in my hand ended the game unceremoniously.

I figure
this match up sort of goes: If they can chip you down quickly with 4 damage burn, you have no game, but if they draw the 2-3 damage burn you can pressure them with creatures such that they cannot aim all their burn at your face and if that happens you're winning.

Round 2 vs B/w Midrange

This was my one loss in the swiss rounds. In game 1, I curved out beautifully with Cackler into Spike Jester. I hd a 2nd Spike Jester in hand but didn't play it to hedge against Bile Blight, which he did have. I managed to get him down to just 11, before he dropped a Brimaz, then a Pack Rat, and finally an Elspeth to win game 1. In game 2, I got a Spike Jester opening and then 2 Rakdos Cacklers. He killed the Jester and fell to 13 from Cacklers. My next turn I played Exava and sent him to just 5 life. He played a BBoV (I hate this card!!!!!!!!!) and stopped my ground assault. I found a Chandra's Phoenix to knock him to just 3. He played a Pack Rat and had a Mutavualt open on blocks. The game ended when I swung all
out with 5 creatures, he blocked my Exava and I HDFed her before damage to send him to -1 from the 2 unblocked 2/2s. Game 3 came down to a situation in which we were both gassed. I killed all his creatures and even had to trade 2 for 1 into his Obzedat that he blocked with. The issue was that with both of us top decking, I ripped land-land-land where he ripped DD, Pack Rat, and Doom Blade. After 3 blank draw steps I found a pair of Chandra's Phoenix and I was planning to sac my Mutavualt to the Demon so I could push in 4 damage to bring him to just 3, but he Doom Bladed my Mutavualt before I could sac it.

In thinking about this play, I'm wondering if he has priority to even respond at that time. I let the DD trigger go on the stack and respond by activating my Mutavault. He can respond to the Mutavualt activation with Doomblade, but then it's still my turn so I have priority. I guess we both have to pass on the DD trigger for it to resolve so he would get priority, but I wonder.

It was an
unceremonious loss to pack rat after bricking draw steps for multiple turns.

Round 3 vs a strange G/B deck

His deck was like a cross between Mono Black Devotion and Gx Monsters. I had Arbor Elf, Sylvan Caryatid, Pollokranos, but then also DD and Gray Merchant. In game 1 I'm chipping him down with a Chandr's Phoenix which he kills with Abrupt Decay, while I kill his Pollokranos with Dreadbore. The follow up play was Exava to knock him to 10. He plays Gary and drains back up to 14, but I played a FWP, which he paid tribute on allowing me to swing for 5 in the air shile be chumps with Gary. An EoT burn spell dropped him to 7, upon which he conceded. In game 2 his only play of the game was 3 swamps and 1 Underworld Connections, which let me just swing in unimpeded for game. He flashed me a hand of multiple Abrupt Decays and green cards. After the tournament I would stick around and talk to him about Golgari in standard,
where we discovered he was only playing 20 lands.

Round 4 vs G/r Monsters.

Our game 1 was very strange. She plays a stomping ground untapped and lands Elvish Mystic. I play only a guildgate. She takes another 2 from a untapped Stomping ground and plays a Courser. Her top card is SBD. I have no turn 2. She misses her 3rd land drop and plays another Elvish Mystic, which I shock on the End step. We are in a situation where she keeps missing land drops and I finally get an SBD into play to take her to 12, then 8, then 4, but she is dealing me 3 per turn with Courser and Mystic. I eventually have to play Chandra's Phoenix as a blocker to hedge vs a bloodrush, but she ends up losing without ever seeing a 3rd land. Game 2 I lose pretty quickly to an out of control Courser of Kruphix and then multiple SBDs. Game 3 I start off with a Spike Jester and then a Chandra's Phoenix to knock her to 12 and then 7. My ground assault is stifled by A courser and then a bow of Nylea. I played an Exava and finally
forced a chump block by the Courser, but a Bow of Nylea kept her at a healthy 7. I played FWP, which she paid tribute on and then I attacked with it, very surprised by the haste from Exava for exact lethal with 2 Phoenixes.

Round 5, Intentional Draw

Top 8 vs B/w Midrange.

Game 1 I had a good aggressive start, which he completely shut down with 4 removal spells in a row, including last breath. He made his first 5 land land drops and then went turn 5 DD, turn 6 DD, and turn 7 BBoV. Pretty much the nut draw B/w always wants. Game 2 I get a turn 1 Rakdos Cakcler and a Chandra's Phoenix which lets me chip him down to 14 over a few turns, but he slams a BBoV again and it takes me a few turns to find the MM for it. When I do and kill it he's sitting at 22 and has a LBZ in play while i'm at 9. I find my own LBZ to block, but by this point I'm only at 3 life and he has a Mutavualt. I block LBZ and fall to 1 and my top card is Magma Jet. I know he has a card in hand, but I fugure the play is to save it
and burn out the Mutavualt. He shows me teh card on his turn, Duress. I die to a Mutavualt. In retrospect the play there was to Magma Jet him on my own turn and get back Chandra's Phoenx to use as a Blocker, but the game seemed pretty hard to stabilize at that point anyway because I was at 1 and he was at 20.

With 2 losses to B/w I'm really considering adding the LBZs main, but at the same time, I feel like B/w is a deck that is going out of style, with it's old favorable match up. Mono B Devotion, proving that by playing LBZ over NVS that the match up now favors Mono Black. I think my greatest wish if for B/W to just go out of style completely before Charlotte.

What do you think of the Rakdos deck that won the 5K? Is that where we want to be?

The list from the 5k and our current lists are fairly similar.
We have a slightly heavier creature base, with either zombie or phoenix, while he went with packrat. We also have a bit more removal, and our hero's downfalls are better then his ultimate prices. As far as landbases, he fit in an extra vault because of the lack of hdf, and instead of 2 guildgates, has 2 mismatched temples, one for each color.

I like the list, but I think ours is slightly better at the moment. His has a tiny bit more game vs control, while ours is better vs midrange and aggro, and having more planeswalker killspells helps vs control as well.

I kinda want to talk to him and hear how packrat went during the day, because as I've mentioned before, it and ash zealot are at the top of my list for inclusion as a 3-of.

You really think Chandra will compensate enough for his late of haste creature to make his deck better vs control? Its the Opp. his deck is better vs aggro and midrange while we're better vs Control.

I would play the rats as well if MODO was infested with black and UW.

My statements were based on his slightly higher creature count and lower manacost. But when his rats are all dead vs control...

And I said we were better vs aggro/midrange cause we have so much removal.


Anyway, I never got your thoughts MDU. If the cacklers got replaced with 3x of a two drop and a whip main, which 2-drop would you want? Zealot or rat? Rat just wins certain matchups, while zealot hurts control and is another hasty creature.

We have more burn he actually has more removal then us

In your meta (assuming it hasn't changed since the Rw days) I'll take the Rats (to combat Gx fest), in my meta I'll take the Ash (so I don't just die to Dsphere or Bight Bile).

He has 2 dreadbore 2 ultimate price, how is that more then our 3 dreadbore 3 hero's downfall? ;P


That makes sense meta-wise, but which would you take to a wide-open meta?
These are just questions I like asking.

I'd personally say ash, since she's better against more of the top decks, with only g/r or jund monster being weaker to rat. And small aggro too, but that's not a 'top deck' at the moment.

I somehow read that as 4x Dreadbore and 2x UP In that case, I think we're better overall outside the unanswered T2 Pack Rats.

In an open meta I'll play this list which I'll test tonight (first game in magic in two weeks, so I may play a few or just build Modern Robots)

[deck=MDU's Magic Online Championship Season One - RB Aggro-Control v1]Lands 24
7 Mountain
5 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Temple Of Malice
2 Rakdos Guildgate
2 Mutavault

Creatures 19
3 Ash Zealot
4 Spike Jester
2 Lifebane Zombie
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
3 Stormbreath Dragon

Spells 16
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
2 Shock
3 Dreadbore
3 Hero's Downfall

Artifact / Enchantment 01
1 Whip of Erebos

Sideboard 15
2 Devour
Flesh
2 Lifebane Zombie
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Doom Blade
3 Skullcrack[/deck]

Devour Flesh is my nod at burn, Uw + Rb Devotion and Auras. The MOCS1 (Magic Online Championship Season One) starts this week Sat at 7:00 AM PST (which is Sunday 2:00 AM my time) I was going to stream it live but I don't feel like giving the idea of having "peek" casted on my for 0cc all turns every turns.

I like the look of the list!
Let me know how the mana ends up going, cause with the 7/5 mountain/swamp split with lbz and the whip main makes me worry. I guess with zealot there it does make sense though... Still worried it might go weird on occasion.

But yeah, the version I've got sleeved right now for testing before fnm/the iq this weekend is basically the same, just with phoenix instead of zombie, and the third zombie and a second whip in the side instead of the 2 devour flesh.

Its greedy but... Pro GW grinders have been running with 16[mana]G[/mana] / 15[mana]W[/mana], since we're also running gates in our brew I manage to create the same numbers 17[mana]R[/mana] / 15[mana]B[/mana] though I may run the 3rd gate over a mountain so I'll be 17[mana]R[/mana] / 16[mana]B[/mana] not sure if 2x Vaults is worth 11 cipt lands but we'll see.

I really should just cut one vaults for another Swamp... BUT ITS A VAULTS COME ON!!

Nah, I'm with ya on this one. I think 2 vaults is the right number.
Since the only 1 drop in the list is shock, I think a 3rd guildgate isn't too far off the mark. I guess testing will tell, lol.

Any chance you'll stream your testing today? I'm bored with nothing to do ;P

MDU, you changed your avatar and I didn't recognize you.

On streaming: Can't you set a delay to the stream so that it's several minutes behind? It would mean that you can't really interact with the people typing comments, but it would stop any peeking.

I've been playing MDU's old list:

[deck]Lands 24
7 Mountain
4 Swamp
4 Blood Crypt
4 Temple of Malice
3 Rakdos Guildgate
2 Mutavault

Creatures 20
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Spike Jester
4 Chandra's Phoenix
3 Exava, Rakdos Blood Witch
2 Flame-Wreathed Phoenix
3 Stormbreath Dragon

Spells 17
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
3 Shock
3 Dreadbore
2 Hero's Downfall

Sideboard 15
2 Mizzium Mortars
3 Lifebane Zombie
3 Dark Betrayal
3 Doom Blade
4 Skullcrack[/deck]

I'm 15 wins - 3 losses with it in paper. I think that the main decks have sort of evolved past my build, but I'm not playing Standard again till Friday so I can wait a bit to makes
changes.

Even on a delay, streaming could cause problems. Even if what they see if a few minutes old, it can still be relevant.


Also, the lists really haven't changed all that much. As I said before, the differences at this point boil down to about 4 questions.
Your list is still really solid, and a 83.3% match win rate isn't anything to sneeze at ;P

MDU, you changed your avatar and I didn't recognize you.

That happened to me too!

@Gutler: What match-ups have you been playing, and what have your losses been against? Your list is su close to mine that the only real difference is cacklers vs ashley and I'm still trying to figure out which is better, when.