Dies to Removal

If they're playing Blood Baron bring in your Searing Bloods.

About to play a list very similar to Val's in a GPT! Slightly different sideboard. I'll post a report after.

I think it's good you cut down the chandra's as her 0 ability becomes more and more of a risk if you're upping the terrors count.

As a general statement that's certainly true, but let's break it down a bit.

This is a kind of list that will allow you to run only a couple terrors main deck and board more terrors for match-specific needs. That means you can stack your main deck with more burn, which certainly fits well with Chandra's 0 ability.

Post-board against a deck like G/r monsters, you're certainly bringing in more terror cards. The question becomes, what to do with Chandra?
My untested theory is that you keep her as 2x in the list for these reasons.
1. Her +1 is relevant to recur your Phoenix as an infinite blocker
2. Her +1 is relevant to swing through their fat by making something unable to block
3. Her 0 is actually relevant against a deck packed with large, fat, value creatures. If you flip a terror with her, you'll almost certainly have a target.
4. For those rare occasions where flipping a terror would have no target, you're likely ahead on board anyway and don't even need to 0.

And against a deck where you don't need terror effects, you can board them out or simply not bring them in. I think the only remaining issue is how to play it with Dreadbore in the main against UW/x control, but you either +1 or 0 depending on board state there as well - just like you did with Chained against Mono Black Devotion in the PyroWhite list.

Dammit dude I can't argue with this

I guess I'll have to start looking for chandra's again...

Btw, I'm
still unsure about the SB, how has Satyr Nyx-Smith performed for everyone? I have actually been running with an extra mutavault SB and that has overperformed for me so far.

Oh and I got absolutely SMASHED by mono B aggro today, does anyone have experience with the matchup? Seems like the guy had an answer for everything, he kept shredding my hand and he had a removal spell for every creature I played.

PS: I think we should also take a look at this deck, MDU posted it in the dos rakis thread but since it relies heavily on young peezy I think it belongs here as well

[deck]MDU PyroBlack[/deck]

I'm not a fan of it personally but it certainly plays some powerful cards.

Satyr Nyx-Smith is quite terrible against the current G2-3 UW builds, so I can't recommend him at all.

In regards to my "pyro" list - its not as fluid or synergistic as the usually "pyro" so it wouldn't really appeal to those accustomed to that style.

Which is why I left it in the Dos Rakdos thread, where we don't give two **** about the manabase and just jam every powerful card within the "RB" range we can find

MDU, what would you run instead of the Nyx-Smith in Val's list?

MDU, what would you run instead of the Nyx-Smith in Val's list?

I wouldn't play Val's list because I'll be concerned about the Ux, Rx and Gx Devotion MU - but if I was to replace Nyx-Smith which is used against Control I'll recommend either 2x [card]Toil // Trouble[/card] or 1 Mutavault + Chandra, Pyromaster.

MDU, what would you run instead of the Nyx-Smith in Val's list?

I wouldn't play Val's list because I'll be concerned about the Ux, Rx and Gx Devotion MU - but if I was to replace Nyx-Smith which is used against Control I'll recommend either 2x [card]Toil // Trouble[/card] or 1 Mutavault + Chandra, Pyromaster.

Is this concern of yours about the pyroblack archetype in general or just his list?

The archetype in general, when your pack your list with 2/x power guys with no flying your just asking for trouble against the more aggressive or mid-range type plans.

When I was actively playing this archetype and notice the decline in Bx Devotion (it still made up most of the meta but it wasn't every match anymore) and increase in Gx, Rx and Ux builds I decided to run 2x SBD with 23 lands to deal with the issue, but nowadays I feel that Firedrinker Satyr is more trouble then he is worth (unless your meta is chock full of Bx Devotion and Control).

That Young Rakdos list I posted gets around this issue with LBZ and SBD with more haste creature to make up for the lack of 1-drops.

Well my FNM is filled to the brim with Gr monster and Rx, Wx and Bx aggro decks that's why I asked

too bad, the deck is fun but it seems to have a lot of bad matchups now

I personally feel this list lines up quite well with Gr monsters. The Ux matchup is concerning for sure.

Last night at FNM I attended running R/W PyroRed and I was absolutley not disappointed in it by any means. I went 3 - 1 for the night.

2 - 1 UW aggro.

A simple sideboard ofChained to the Rocks and Glare of Heresy made all the difference. Brimaz is painful but when he and two Boros Rockners were answered so cheaply and efficiently it was over both games.

2 - 1 Mono Black Devotion

Thankfully, I didn't see a single Gary and burnt his face off both games I won(I actually would have went 2 - 0 but I misplayed once and it ruined everything). He had to waste so much good removal on Firedrinker Satyrs and Young Pyromancers my Phoenixes and Burn simply killed him. He sideboarded a full compliment of discard but, when he went to duress early on both
games all I had was creatures.

0 - 2 Green Red Everything

I was stomped to death both times...I really should be running a R/B list...

I played my heart out on the second game and with some clever removal usage/[card]Chandra's Phoenix[/card] reviving as well as utilizing Chandra I killed five planeswalkers over the course of the one game...but, it was all lost once he activated the second Garruk and got a handful of every creature Red Green needs to end a game...

2 - 1 RedGreenDragonsControl...?

Yeah, the first game was dumb. I settled for a hand of land, removal and oneyoung pyromancer(I was dreamking of an army of tokens in Magic Christmas land) and promptly gave him time to cast all the dragons.

The other two games PyroRed curved perfectly and I ripped him to pieces with multiple [card]Ash Zealot[
/card]s and [card]Chandra's Phoenix[/card]es when I needed them along with the proper side boarded Burn to deal with his single Stormbreath Dragon he played in the final game. He was not pleased losing two games and winning one in 20 minutes.

But, yes, biggest lesson of the night...I need to play Black instead of White in my PyroRed.

So I played in a BUNCH of stuff with Rb the last two days. Here are some of my observations playing this exact list:

[deck]Walter Black[/deck]




Friday Night Magic ($10 tier, lots of grinders present hoping to get some practice in before the IQ in the morning)
3-1

Game 1, match 1 was against mono black ft. Blood Baron. I thought this matchup might be terrible because they can Grey Merchant you, but I killed
him too quickly in game 1. I kept an aggro hand with double satyr, a mutavault, some burn and a mountain. He just couldn't resolve a blocker.
Game 2 was similar, I boarded in Mizzium Mortars and brought out the Flames of the Firebrand in the main, leaving the rest of the deck untouched. I toyed with the idea of bringing in Slaughter Games but figured it was too slow, and I didn't bring in Ratchet Bomb because the deck doesn't care about Pack Rats. I kept a similar hand to the last one, and he resolved a Desecration Demon on turn 4, which I started feeding Cacklers. Before he knew it he was dead to a flurry of 2/2s.

Game 1, match 2 was against GW Hexproof, which come to find out is a miserable matchup. He mulligan'd really aggressively in both games we played, which I assume means he was looking for either Fleecemane Lion or [card]
Alpha Authority[/card] + a different creature. Game 1 was the Fleecemane, which just relentlessly pounded my buttocks.
Game 2 I brought in Boros Reckoner and Erebos. Erebos came in because I thought he might be playing Unflinching Courage, and I couldn't beat the lifelink portion of that card, but I might be able to race him otherwise. I was right about the Unflinching Courage, but he had boarded in some Gods Willings that really put the beat on me. Each time I had the removal spell he had the Gods Willing. Eventually I lost while he was at 4. :\

Game 1, match 3 was the matchup I wanted to play against; UW control. This deck is laughably easy to beat with Pyro, and our games were very, very short. Game 1 I kept a hand that had no colored lands in it whatsoever, but all 4 Mutavaults. I snap kept it, assuming he was going to durdle until Divination. He kept a hand that was counter-centric, so when turn 3 came and he left mana open to Dissolve my play and I played nothing, he sighed
deeply and was like "Oh, so you're on that plan." A few turns later, after I still hadn't cast a single spell, he just scooped up. This was REALLY nice because he had no idea what deck I was playing, so he went to board completely blind.

Game 2, match 3 was pretty similar. I kept an (arguably) better hand with 2 Mutavaults, 1 Mountain, a Skullcrack and some other assorted burn spells. My board against him was +2 Erebos, +3 Skullcrack, -2 Mizzium Mortars, -1 Flames of the Firebrand, -2 Shock. Basically just looking to hose his Revelation if it ever got to that point. Sadly, I played both Mutavaults and went to town on him again. He played a Jace at one point, but I had drawn both the Dreadbore and the black source on my first two draw steps, so he wasn't going to have a good time.

Game 1, match 4 was against the mirror-ish, as he was still on RW. I had been scouting around in between matches out of boredom, so I knew what deck my opponent was on before I sat down. I was chatting
with the guy and he had just picked up the deck not terribly long ago, so game 1 I gave him a pretty thorough romping. He kept a typical aggro hand, including 2 Satyrs, but unfortunately for him I had the opposite hand of both of my Mortars, as well as a Phoenix and some burn. He took 8 from his own Satyrs, while only having dealt 4 to me with them, so he had already started off behind. From there it was basically just me killing him with Phoenix. He killed it about 4 times before eventually just running out of ways to kill it after I recurred.

Game 2, match 4 was a little different. I flooded pretty badly and he played an on-curve Stormbreath. I didn't even bother going from there, I just scooped it up. I boarded in Flames and Reckoners for this matchup and brought out my 1drops.

Game 3, match 4 was well in my favor. He left in his 1drops (which is a mistake for anyone thinking about picking up this deck, you generally board out your aggressive creatures in any matchup that isn't control,
and instead take the control route yourself out of the board.) and they met with Reckoner pretty quickly, which made his attacks really bad. I killed his only active attacker, a phoenix, a bunch of times and then eventually resolved my own. Game was stalled for a bit, I topdecked a Chandra that went unanswered and I ulted her into Lightning Strike. We both laughed.






More to come later.

Saturday, SCG Super IQ.

My shop does free buy-ins for 9th-16th at IQs, and I made 9th at the last one, so I was playing for free, which was already a good way to start the day.

Round 1 vs. Esper

G1
My opponent sits down and immediately asks me what deck I'm playing. Thinking this was odd, I just told him I was playing Monsters, and his immediate response was "Oh, my best matchup." I couldn't tell if he was fucking with me or not. Either way, I was on the play, and I opened the typical aggro hand of some Cacklers and Firedrinkers, as well as some burn and land. The game was pretty short, I think he actually kept his hand assuming I was on Monsters, because he had back-to-back Supreme Verdicts. By the time those happened he was already in the danger zone so I just burned him out.

G2 (-4 Cacklers, -2 Firedrinker Satyr, -2 Mizzium Mortars, +3 Slaughter Games, +2 Erebos, +3
Skullcrack)
This game was a lot different. I mulled to 6 after pitching a 4lander, my 6 was really good though. (Slaughter Games, Temple, Crypt, Dreadbore, Erebos, Mountain) I snap kept this. We durdled for a few turns, when on T3 I topdeck a Phoenix and slam it. He takes two, then on his turn Detention Spheres it. Turn four comes and I play Slaughter Games, naming Detention Sphere. He reveals his hand and the other 3 Spheres were right there. The following turn I resolved Erebos and the card draw allowed me to stay so far ahead of him that he really didn't have a way back into the game.

Round 2 vs. GW.

G1
This was the same guy I played against the previous evening at FNM, and in much the same fashion, our games were really close but ultimately fulfilling for me. To put it simply, he wrecked me. I tried to take an aggro hand in game 1, but he slammed an Unflinching Courage on a Gladecover Scout and pretty much just made the game unwinnable for me.

G2 (-2 Chandra,
-2 Firedrinker Satyr, -4 Rakdos Cackler, +2 Erebos, +3 Slaughter Games, +3 Boros Reckoner)
I opened a hand of triple mountain, triple Reckoner, Mizzium Mortars. I kept the everliving fuck out of this hand. He groaned at the t3 reckoner, signed at the t4 reckoner, and cried at the t5 reckoner. He just had no good attacks the entire game. I eventually drew Stormbreath and got in there that way.

G3 (-2 Erebos, +2 Ratchet Bomb)
I brought in Ratchet Bomb thinking he would probably try and mulligan to Alpha Authority in hopes that he didn't lose as badly to Boros Reckoner. Unfortunately for me, I didn't see one of those bombs despite mulling to 6 specifically to try and find one. I didn't think going to 5 was wise in a matchup where every card could count, as our life totals were always down to the wire. I was right, he got exactly the hand I was anticipating, and I lost to it despite resolving that important T3 reckoner.

Round 3 vs. RW Humans

G1
I had no idea what my opponent was playing
since all he did was play temples and shrines while I murdered him with 1drops and Mutavaults. He never actually cast a spell. I put him on Walter White because of this, so I sideboarded pretty poorly...

G2 (-4 Cacklers, -2 Firedrinker, +1 Mizzium Mortars, +3 Boros Reckoner, +1 Flames, +1 Slaughter Games)
I brought in that one Slaughter Games in hopes that I would be able to see what the fuck was going on over there if I drew it. I know the 1drops in the mirror are awful, so I took them out and simply didn't have a sixth card to bring in. He drew much better this game, curving out pretty hard. Flames of the Firebrand did a lot of work but eventually he just kept drawing live and I stopped doing so.

G3
I didn't change the board since I still didn't have another good card against him. I considered Ratchet Bomb but that seemed pretty miserable too. I flooded again, which was unfortunate, so I just got my ass beat. I wish I could say I put up a fight but I really didn't.

Round 4 vs. UW

nG1
This was the same UW player I played the previous evening as well. He was already tilting pretty hard, he's a good friend of mine as well as a pretty hardcore grinder, so the fact that he was in the X-2 bracket really had him close to just dropping all together. We were both still playing for at least 9-16, so we went to the game, where I kept a very aggressive hand with Cacklers and Mutavaults, and he kept a hand with Supreme Verdicts for decades. It got to the point in the game where I was drawing off of the top, but thankfully I drew super live and found a moment to resolve a Stormbreath in between his Jace -2s. He -2'd into a Revelation but by that point I had him at dead with Monstrous.

G2 (-3 Shock, -1 Flames of the Firebrand, -2 Mizzium Mortars, +2 Erebos, +3 Skullcrack, +1 Slaughter Games)
This game was really close. I ate a lot of Supreme Verdicts and he ate a lot of Mutavaults. He had me at 8 from Elspeth tokens, and I had him at 4. He had Rev in hand again but I had Monstrous
active for the Rev again. Eventually he went for it with Verdict, I responded with Monstrous, and he responded with Revelation, which would have put him at 1 after Monstrous. I had the Skullcrack, and we shook hands.

From here on I'm a little fuzzy on what I played, fatigue was really starting to set in, but I ended the day 4-2 which was good enough for exactly 17th place. I went and got food, and then we proceeded to play in a win-a-box for a Korean M14 box, which my partner and I split for at the end. We cracked a Mutavault, a foil Rise of the Dark Realms, and a couple of planeswalkers. I believe Garruk, Jace, and Ajani.

All in all it was a good day, and the deck feels really good. I can't think of anything off of the top of my head that I would change, since it is really good at one of the more popular archetypes right now.
If the meta shifts to GR Monsters then obviously Ultimate Price should find a place in my list, but I couldn't find any of those before the tournament since my shop was totally sold out, so I just had to make due.

Did you run into any G/R Monsters? That's the one deck I'm most concerned about (nearly half the players at the place I play FNM ate on some kind of green midrange), so I'd like to hear what you have to say about facing that deck when you're splashing black instead of white).

From someone who plays Gr monsters, PyroBlack should be favored postboard with access to both Pyromancer and 10+ terrors. Dreadbore is important to clear out an early Domri and Xenagod isn't quite that scary with Elemental blockers barring evasion.

The meta here is mostly UW control, so no, I managed to dodge GR Monsters in the actual IQ. I played against it twice in a row at the win-a-box afterwards, beating it both times 2-0. The deck didn't seem terribly well matched against a deck with Young Pyromancer in it, since most of the threats don't have trample.

If the deck is somehow a problem, play Ultimate Price. Like I said, I would have been playing it instead of those Ratchet Bombs and the Flames in the board, but I just couldn't find any UPs before the tournament.

Alex, how has slaughter games worked for you? Im preparing decks to test with this week for the Atlanta Open. Anything you would change about the deck knowing GR Monsters and UW dominated the St Lous open

Slaughter Games was incredibly good in some games. It is pretty great against UW for this reason:

G2 (-4 Cacklers, -2 Firedrinker Satyr, -2 Mizzium Mortars, +3 Slaughter Games, +2 Erebos, +3 Skullcrack)
This game was a lot different. I mulled to 6 after pitching a 4lander, my 6 was really good though. (Slaughter Games, Temple, Crypt, Dreadbore, Erebos, Mountain) I snap kept this. We durdled for a few turns, when on T3 I topdeck a Phoenix and slam it. He takes two, then on his turn Detention Spheres it. Turn four comes and I play Slaughter Games, naming Detention Sphere. He reveals his hand and the other 3 Spheres were right there. The following turn I resolved Erebos and the card draw allowed me to stay so far ahead of him that he really didn't have a way back into the game.

Its funny because my playtest partner, Jabberwocky, was judging the event and after
the game he was like "It seemed pretty weird that you would name Detention Sphere instead of a win condition" but I explained to him that I needed to resolve an Erebos, and Detention Sphere was the only card in their deck that could stop him.




Beyond that, I didn't actually draw it that often. I don't think it is that good against GR monsters, but I was still bringing it in anyway because I didn't have Ultimate Price and it was better than any of the other stuff when I was boarding out my 1drops.

Hi guys. Need some help from you. I will play next Saturday game day with Rw in a meta full of Red decks (all kind Rw devotion, Pyroburn, Agroo) . In the store are always Mono Black and Mono Blue and RG (usually devotion but I think It will change for Monsters). Other deck that I will face for sure and will be the second most representative after Red decks will be GW agroo; third and fourth will be UW control and Wx agroo. I will play Rw for sure because I can't get the new temples and some other black spells at time and I don't have anyone that let me borrow the cards.

In a meta like that are your advices for my Rw deck? Pyrodragons? Change for Rw devotion or Rw Burn? Or make a mixture of some. I think the Mono Black have a really god pilot in the store and I usually go to the final with him, and he will be a strong opponent. I didn't play much since BotG came out. I really want to try a Rakdos build but I don't
have time this week to get all the cards. So in a Rw build what are your advices for the deck choise?

Thanks in advance to all.

P.S. - Last time a play the follow build to test Firedancer and Searing Blood, but I feel the deck are not very well "Finished".

Someone resolved two Slaughter Games against my Gr monsters at FNM last Friday, nabbing two Stormbreath Dragons from my hand and clearing out the Xenagos planeswalker from my deck. I gave no fucks and slaughtered (lol) him while he was spending two turns casting 4cmc spells that did nothing.

tl;dr save the Slaughter Games for UW control.

From someone who plays Gr monsters, PyroBlack should be favored postboard with access to both Pyromancer and 10+ terrors. Dreadbore is important to clear out an early Domri and Xenagod isn't quite that scary with Elemental blockers barring evasion.

I agree. I'm also keeping the Reckoners in the board the way the PyroWhite list used to, which will also come in against Gr monsters. 4x Dreadbore, 2x Ultimate Price, 1x Doom Blade, X Mortars, X Reckoner, and some of your MD burn should all go a very long way.

If I had Ultimate Prices available, I would have played them instead of the Ratchet Bombs and the extra Flames in the board. Not huge on Doom Blade surprisingly, as I feel the GR Monsters matchup is already pretty favorable. I don't want to devote too much of the sideboard to it, especially when I can play cards that are SO good against control archetypes. I mean, those decks have a really hard time beating a resolved Erebos.

Alex, your list looks a lot closer to where I want to be. I ran Val's list in a GPT on the weekend and ended up 3-2, in 10th. I lost to mono black and a 4 colour super friends deck, and really didn't like how good Sylvan Caryatid Was against Ash Zealot, and Stormbreath is pretty solid against planes walkers which there seem to be a lot of.

One of the main issues I've been having with Val's list is top decking removal instead of burn or creatures for turn after turn allowing my opponent to stabilise the board.

I'm really liking your list, Alex. Green midrqnr and Black Devotion match-ups feel really solid, and aggro is pretty much a bye. I've been trying out Tymaret in place of the third Stormbreath, and have liked him so far. I'm questioning the SB Erebos, though. Is he just for blue control decks?

If you resolve Erebos against control they HAVE to find Detention Sphere. Until they do, you're free to draw cards, which should lead you into finding either Skullcrack or Slaughter Games.

The UW matchup should always be a bye as well because of how good the sideboard is against them.

Also I had a little difficulty with aggro matchups, but I think a large part of the reason why was because they were REALLY random matchups. I mean, RW Humans? Really?

hey alex, are you running 2/2 split in lands (muta/swamp)? you don't have it listed in your list

ah cool, thanks alex

have you thought of 4 firedrinkers/2 cacklers for the extra damage whenever you have extra mana? or do you feel that you always have things to play?

Oh, my bad. No, it is 4 Mutavaults.

I'm planning on running one of these on Game Day:
I'm leaning towards deck 1 because of the Satyrs, they give a bit more power against Sylvan Caryatids.

Honest question...how much of a threat is Bile Blight and Drown on Sorrow against Young Pyromancers? I actaully thinking of replacing them with Gore-House Chainwalkers. Or should I just play around them?

Chainwalker dies to those things as well. Just play around them a bit. Pyro is still one of our best cards against mono black.

@Platypus

Tymaret in your deck number 2 is a super sweet techs! Love it! I don't play Rakdos yet, but I don't swap YP for chainwalker. YP is a house, Chainwalker is a body...

Praise should go to Valdarith, it's pretty close to his deck on page 75.

I'll keep the YPs, I'm probably overthinking it. But I still haven't decided which one I should go with. Metagame is a bit unknown, I haven't played standard since the game day in October. Latest info I have is lots of RDW and mono-black, but some GR monsters and Ux devotion as well. Probably some UWx decks, there usually are. Wouldn't be surprised about a GW deck. I would love to try Tymaret, but my gut says go with deck 1.

I'm not really good help to advice you, because I'm not playing in this new meta. To my next tournament I had ask help to magicdownunder, maybe someone with Radkos experience can help you to chose.

Praise should go to Valdarith, it's pretty close to his deck on page 75.

I'll keep the YPs, I'm probably overthinking it. But I still haven't decided which one I should go with. Metagame is a bit unknown, I haven't played standard since the game day in October. Latest info I have is lots of RDW and mono-black, but some GR monsters and Ux devotion as well. Probably some UWx decks, there usually are. Wouldn't be surprised about a GW deck. I would love to try Tymaret, but my gut says go with deck 1.

White splash seems better in that meta.

Might be. The card I would like to have from a white splash is Boros Reckoner and that might be doable with Godless Shrines instead of Swamps and perhaps dropping a Mutavault. Chained to the Rocks is better than the terrors to remove gods, but I have Devour Flesh as well. A few Warleader's Helixes would of course be nice. But apart from that, I don't think white has more to offer. One problem with white is that I'm borrowing the scrylands, and I'm not sure I can borrow the RW one. And I've wanted to try Exava for a long time...

A hard decision...

Boros charm is a really good card as well.

Just wanna say that this deck is still the tits. I'll probably get the Temple of Malices next week, but the white splash has really been fine so far.

It honestly depends on what you expect in your meta. If you look at the meta globally, black is better positioned because Gr and Jund Monsters are quickly becoming the decks to beat, and black has a massive advantage against those decks. Chained to the Rocks can be a huge liability against them considering their enchantment hate postboard, and being able to bring in more instant speed removal against them is a big deal.