[Primer] Boros Burn

[LP, of the Fires]

I think I'm jumping on this train. Deck is cheap and powerful while having lots of interesting decision tree's and the side benefit of being able to gloat about playing a real dega deck. Expect contributions from this guy in the future.

[Aodh]

Here's a lot of discussion on recent Rx(x) Burn lists. I too will be piloting this to FNM unless the AIR gods demand my participation.

viewtopic.php?f=96&t=989

[Tyrael]

Surprised none of you are running Chandra, seeing as her Phoenix is your most reliable beater...

Have any of you tested this against control? Trying to decide what to run on saturday since my devotion deck keeps screwing me over.

[Elricity]

Read earlier in the thread, I posted my reasons. She's not good here.

[Aodh]

I actually think she'd be really good here; just haven't been able to actually play with the deck to see how games pan out. "2RR: deal 1 damage to one creature and one player, draw and cast an extra card each turn for the rest of the game" seems really good in a burn deck.

[Tyrael]

I thought so too, that's why I asked

[Elricity]

When you try it, you'll see what I mean. She's slow and squishy here.

Now that said, since I'm waiting on all the key pieces for any of the betterpyro varient builds, I'm going to take this to FNM tomorrow as last hurrah.

[deck]
4 ash zealot
4 chandra's phoenix
3 young pyromancer

4 shock
4 lightning strike
4 magma jet
4 boros charm
3 warleader's helix
2 flames of the firebrand

2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Pyromancer's Gauntlet
2 Chained to the rocks

12 mountain
4 sacred foundry
4 temple of triumph
3 mutavault

SB

4 boros reckoner
4 skullcrack
2 chained to the rocks
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Spark Trooper
2 Mizzium Mortars[/deck]

I don't exactly recommend trying this at home but I'm rolling with the cards I have this week. Nobody at the store seems to play blue devotion and I'm one of the few red players so I skipped rod of ruin and peak erruption. There's another store that has a
more tourney meta but it's also maybe 12 players. It's sloppy but I'd rather get my easier winnings off the 30+ player base who likes to play jank.

[Tyrael]

When you try it, you'll see what I mean. She's slow and squishy here.

Now that said, since I'm waiting on all the key pieces for any of the betterpyro varient builds, I'm going to take this to FNM tomorrow as last hurrah.

[deck]
4 ash zealot
4 chandra's phoenix
3 young pyromancer

4 shock
4 lightning strike
4 magma jet
4 boros charm
3 warleader's helix
2 flames of the firebrand

2 Chandra, Pyromaster
1 Pyromancer's Gauntlet
2 Chained to the rocks

12 mountain
4 sacred foundry
4 temple of triumph
3 mutavault

SB

4 boros reckoner
4 skullcrack
2 chained to the rocks
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Spark Trooper
2 Mizzium Mortars[/deck]

I don't exactly recommend trying this at home but I'm rolling with the cards I have this week.
Nobody at the store seems to play blue devotion and I'm one of the few red players so I skipped rod of ruin and peak erruption. There's another store that has a more tourney meta but it's also maybe 12 players. It's sloppy but I'd rather get my easier winnings off the 30+ player base who likes to play jank.

Do you think this deck (burn-control or whatever you'd want to call it) has a bright future ahead of it or do you believe that the Pyrored/Walter White versions are better?

[Aodh]

Different strokes, Man. I think burn has a slightly better midrange and aggro match-up, with a slightly worse control MU and no possibility of "oops I win" openings.

[Tyrael]

I'm looking for something consistent though, so this might be it then

[Elricity]

Be careful on your math with this one when playing. It's not near as grindy as Walter White so it's even more prone to error.

[Aodh]

Also note that consistent cards are, in general, weaker than inconsistent cards. So you'll be barely squeezing by with most wins, but you will be able to win more often.

[Elricity]

Right, it's why it has a stronger mono blue matchup.

"Oh, you're playing a bunch of dudes, drawing cards, whatever? You just dropped a master of waves? That's cool bro and I'm going to let you finish but take 6 at the end of your turn and another 6 on mine."

[Tyrael]

Awesome, I'm playing devo red right now and sometimes it just explodes into a mess where I get a clean t4 kill 2 games in a row and at times it's just a sitting duck and I get stomped by even the slowest control decks.

Elricity, why are you playing Chandra's in that list, weren't they sub optimal according to you?

[Elricity]

I'm waiting on the following to come in the mail before I can build either list that I want to make

toils
temple of silence
cackler
satyr

So yeah, can't build either version I want to so I'm going with a "tuned" version of the one I brought to states at the start of the season.

To answer directly, it's because of Pyromancer's Gauntlet, Mutavault, and Ash Zealot that I run Chandra in this build. It has 5 more creatures than the burn build which is hopefully enough to make Chandra's +1 effective. It also runs less spells that are likely to be dead exiles game 1.

Personally, I think my list is too bloated on 4+ CMC and/or needs more white sources. Will probably run 1 gate, 1 plains, 10 mountain.

[Tyrael]

I am very interested to see your match report after

I'll be running my devo red deck for the last time this saturday then

[zemanjaski]

Chandra is real bad here, trust me.

PyroRed is better vs. aggro
Boros Burn is better vs. midrange and Mono U
They're both good vs control
I think PyroRed is better vs MBC

[Elricity]

I am very interested to see your match report after

I'll be running my devo red deck for the last time this saturday then

I did decent with it as a 24 land 2 gauntlet version but last week I scrubbed out when I tried to mainboard skullcrack without having the Troubles.

Z, my experience too. Local store is bloated with midrange green so I'm trying to bust through that. Decent amount of bows and whips though so I probably should swallow the bile in my throat and play a single wear // tear. I don't want to try to luck into multiple skullcracks.

[zemanjaski]

Yeah that makes sense. Also 4 Boros Reckoner is the correct number in every sideboard.

[Tyrael]

Chandra is real bad here, trust me.

So I just traded 30 bucks worth of trades for a card I won't be able to use? Daaaaang.

Thanks anyway, zem.

[zemanjaski]

Well, she's great in other red decks. This one just lacks the structure to support her.

[Tyrael]

Pyro Red isn't affordable for me atm and I'm still not sure if I can fit her into my devo deck so that sucks I guess

[Elricity]

Back to this build, are you still running the extra mountain? I haven't had it bite me yet casting cackler on 13 first turn lands although I've had plenty of games where my first 2 lands come into play tapped. Not that it usually matters.

Hitting land 3, assuming 1 scry, is a 1 in 4 vs 1 in 5 between 21 and 22 lands.

@Tyreal, I'm sure you can trade her away just as easily. I did the same thing with the angers.

Edit: Or hang onto her. Each varient is a meta call so being able to flip inbetween forms is valuable and they share similar card pools. Snagging a second Chandra and a couple mutavaults can just be a long term goal to use your store credit on.

[zemanjaski]

I tried 21 land with a second YP last night, was ok. Haven't got enough games under my belt yet.

[Elricity]

I've had some iffy draws.

I had a couple draws of on the draw that I kept:

1 Temple of Triumph
1 Jet
1-2 shock
3-4 Glork

23% chance of missing the 2nd drop on that. Drops to 14% if you're willing to wait until turn 3 because you have a shock.
38% of flunking on the play so...yeah, not doing that.

[zemanjaski]

I played standard burn in scars-inn and I learned then its insanely important to hit 4 land in a timely manner with this sort of deck; you need to be able to cast two spells a turn to dump your hand fast enough.

[Elricity]

Noted

[Tyrael]

@Tyreal, I'm sure you can trade her away just as easily. I did the same thing with the angers.

Edit: Or hang onto her. Each varient is a meta call so being able to flip inbetween forms is valuable and they share similar card pools. Snagging a second Chandra and a couple mutavaults can just be a long term goal to use your store credit on.

Sadly, I have been on a terrible losing spree for weeks due to my deck stumbling a lot (3-1 is the best I've gone so far but I usually go 1-3...)

I'll look into my other options though

[LP, of the Fires]

4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Boros Charm
4 Skullcrack
4 Lightning Strike
4 Magma Jet
4 Chained to the Rocks
3 Warleader's Helix
4 Shock
4 Temple of Triumph
4 Temple of Silence
9 Mountain
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Firedrinker Satyr
2 Toil

Board:
2 Spark Trooper
2 Toil
4 Boros Reckoner
2 Anger of the Gods
1 Peak Eruption
2 Young Pyromancer
2 Mizzium Mortars

Current build. Haven't toyed around with it really other then changing the ash zealot to a second firedrinker as I always want to start the game with a 1-drop. The anger's in the board are likely the most mediocre card, but they have real value vs. Devotion decks, especially green, so we'll keep a couple. Also, gonna work on boarding plans soon as I have an idea of what I want to do, but some matchups(mono-black) I feel iffy on.

For people who want to play Chandra and burn, the origins of the pyro agro deck are something like this:

4
cackler
4 satyr
4 ash zealot
4 ypeezy
4 Chandra's phoenix

4 Chandra, thunder thighs

4 boros charm
4 lightning strike
4 magma jet
2 other cards.

It's z's initial brew having been a sketch once all the cards where spoiled. take from that what you may.

[Elricity]

@Tyreal, I'm sure you can trade her away just as easily. I did the same thing with the angers.

Edit: Or hang onto her. Each varient is a meta call so being able to flip inbetween forms is valuable and they share similar card pools. Snagging a second Chandra and a couple mutavaults can just be a long term goal to use your store credit on.

Sadly, I have been on a terrible losing spree for weeks due to my deck stumbling a lot (3-1 is the best I've gone so far but I usually go 1-3...)

I'll look into
my other options though

Deck list?

[Keftenk]

Sorry, off topic. What the fck Zem? You're new sig creeps me out...

[F.I.A]

Do we have a need for some Blind Obedience? It shuts down haste dudes while allowing our creatures to go past the newly placed blockers.

Really like how explosive this deck can get. MODO did not deal me enough powerful hand last night, but 2 Boros Charm and [card]Warleader's Helix[/card] just wreck face. Mirror match leads to an awkward draw pilgrim game style.

Zem's sig looks like something straight from Ito Junji's works. And no, better not google that one.

[Elricity]

Why do we care about opponent's haste dudes?

[zemanjaski]

It's a reasonable mana sink as well. I don't hate it.

[F.I.A]

Why do we care about opponent's haste dudes?

Because there's that dragon which we cannot remove efficiently, so slowing it down helps us in the race. It also makes opposing phoenix less stellar since they will need to take a turn before they can block ours.

[Narcasus]

Played some tonight in the 2-man ques, went 4-1 with elricity's list shown on the previous page. One drops put in alot of damage in most games and were good blockers in the agro matchup. beat esper, monoblack devotion, AIR, and G/u devotion. Lost to GBW gain all the life deck. I was happy with the list, especially the reckoners the 2 sets i played them. esper felt almost easy? I know you guys were talking about u/w but i haven't faced it to give my opinion yet. AIR was extremely tight all three games. Black got stuck on land game 2, and G/u devotion died pretty easily as long as i killed dorks and kept mana open for skull crack. The G/B/W deck felt impossible. whip and baron and ooze plus more lifegain post board was a nightmare.

[Narcasus]

Why do we care about opponent's haste dudes?

Because there's that dragon which we cannot remove efficiently, so slowing it down helps us in the race. It also makes opposing phoenix less stellar since they will need to take a turn before they can block ours.

What would you cut for it? Our sideboard seems so tight already. maybe a YP?

[F.I.A]

What would you cut for it? Our sideboard seems so tight already. maybe a YP?

I think I'll try a session with them instead of [card]Warleader's Helix[/card]. True, the helix packs quite a punch, but it's a little too mana intensive, and I feel bad when I have 2 of them in hand.

[Elricity]

I am very interested to see your match report after

I'll be running my devo red deck for the last time this saturday then

I just got invited to go to a bikini restaraunt with the wife so...cya!

[Tyrael]

@Tyreal, I'm sure you can trade her away just as easily. I did the same thing with the angers.

Edit: Or hang onto her. Each varient is a meta call so being able to flip inbetween forms is valuable and they share similar card pools. Snagging a second Chandra and a couple mutavaults can just be a long term goal to use your store credit on.

Sadly, I have been on a terrible losing spree for weeks due to my deck stumbling a lot (3-
1 is the best I've gone so far but I usually go 1-3...)

I'll look into my other options though

Deck list?

[deck]Creatures (30)
4 Rakdos Cackler
4 Firedrinker Satyr
4 Ash Zealot
4 Burning-Tree Emissary
4 Chandra's Phoenix
4 Gore-House Chainwalker
3 Firefist Striker
3 Fanatic of Mogis

Spells (7)
4 Lightning Strike
3 Shock
Lands (23)
2 Mutavault
21 Mountain

Sideboard (15)
3 Flames of The Firebrand
2 Peak Eruption
1 Chandra, Pyromaster
2 Skullcrack
1 Hammer of Purphoros
2 Mizzium Mortars
4 Boros Reckoner[/deck]

Meta is mostly control with a good amount of aggro and midrange decks. I have tried Burning Earth but it just ended up being a 'win more' card vs three color decks which is why I took them out.